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Can We Have A Civil Discussion About The War Between The States ?
You haven't seen me compliment any but Grant and Hooker have you ?
H Tower sums up Grant well. A tenacious bulldog.
And probably good in bar fight.
Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
"Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead
Originally posted by jimmytrick
My dad, who is 82 and in the next room singing hymns... and I would gleefully kill as many Yankees as I could. I will go to my grave hating. And for an eternity spit north in Hell, if I can summon any spittle.
Wow! That is so cool! Surely even you must concede that that is the place you are most likely bound for. If your Dad is just like you you can tell him to stop singing as it isn't going to do him one bit of good.
I'd give you your precious Confederacy back if I could, minus the slaves of course. You should bear in mind that most likely it would be a pariah nation, cut off from the world, with a resultant economy roughly on a par with North Korea's.
"I say shoot'em all and let God sort it out in the end!
Yes, that's constructive and informing.
Thank you for that input, Sawbones.
Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
"Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead
Maybe you guys can tell me what is so interesting about the Civil War. I never understood it.
What's not interesting about it? Brother against Brother. Perhaps the first modern war. Ripped apart the US and defines the present more than any other conflict in US history (even the American Revolution pales).
I'm more interested in wars between nations for some reasons. I think I should be more interested, but I'm not.
"When you ride alone, you ride with Bin Ladin"-Bill Maher
"All capital is dripping with blood."-Karl Marx
"Of course, my response to your Marx quote is 'So?'"-Imran Siddiqui
Originally posted by H Tower
Grant didn't know much beyond keep fighting. His strategy, if you could call it that was to grab the enemy by the jacket and not let go.
That's a gross generalization if I ever heard it. Grant was a fine general in many regards, and was certainly quite skilled at maneuver. It was discussed at length in this thread:
If that's the Lee vs. Grant thread, I stayed out of it entirely, because the question was so stupid.
Jackson, Longstreet, Hampton all better.
Fitz Lee, and his Commander JEB Stuart, on Grant's level.
Custer! Man, how did we overlook Custer ?
Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
"Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead
The Union generals, I think are vastly underrated. They didn't have anyone that could match match Lee, Jackson, Stuart, or Longstreet tactically, but many of them were exceptionally talented, particularly Sherman who probably was the most brilliant general, in strategic terms, in the whole war.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
Custer was actually a decent cavalry leader, barring Little Bighorn of course. He was no Stuart, but he was still wasn't as bad as generally thought IMO.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
Originally posted by Ramo
Custer was actually a decent cavalry leader, barring Little Bighorn of course. He was no Stuart, but he was still wasn't as bad as generally thought IMO.
Shush! People are trying to retain their grade school notions of history!
The south had, in Lee, Jackson, Stuart, and Longstreet, what amounted to the dream team....they complimented each other so perfectly that is was....jaw dropping.
In battle after battle, Jackson demonstrated that with only the vaguest of orders, he could intuit what Lee wanted of him, and do it faster and more savagely than anybody had reason to expect from his troops (which is what prompted my "what if" comment earlier). His loss was a *reeling* blow to the Confederate Army. Not saying the South coulda won had he not been lost, but he was....pretty d@mned amazing.
-=Vel=-
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What did Custer accomplish in this war?
Nothing.
Oh, he killed lots of, um er, Native Americans. For a while.
Jimmy gets wound tightly, SB.
Normally, you're a little more low-key.
Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
"Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead
He was a very effective cavalryman. He had the balls to ride at the head of numerous charges without calling retreats, etc. He might not have had the same finesse as Stuart or Forrest, but he was still pretty damn effective IMO.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
While that's nice conjecture, you'll have to produce some statistics for me to believe them and then explain why they contradict the official records of the states, and why I should believe one over the other.
I referred you to the source, you can look 'em up. I've got work to do.
And excuse me, MtG, but AFAIK, it is southern apologists who favor the "monolithic south" argument by asserting none of the Southern states fought over slavery. All these documents show is that, yes, many of them did. It is in no way indicative of a universal mindset.
I've heard many pro-southern speakers and writers say that slavery wasn't the exclusive reason, or the main reason, but I've yet to hear any of them say it was not a reason at all for any southerners. And the monolithic south crap has been spouted in Yankee history textbooks for years, because (one would assume) they don't like to look at the notion that more moderate states had significant enough concerns about the expansion of Federal power assumed by Lincoln.
It seems to me folks like you
"Those people" seems a little more to the point.
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."
Originally posted by Ramo
Custer was actually a decent cavalry leader, barring Little Bighorn of course. He was no Stuart, but he was still wasn't as bad as generally thought IMO.
Custer wasn't a pimple on John Buford's ass. Any stone psycho can lead a charge. For screening, scouting, road control, etc., Custer was utterly undistinguished, and in his later WYA career, he had the freedom of maneuver that naturally occurs when one's cavalry division is unopposed by cavalry forces, and outnumbers enemy infantry and home guards in one's area of operation.
Custer was about a good matchup for Hood in the reckless aggression department. In the later days when Hood was stoned on laudanum.
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."
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