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I'm really looking forward to the Blues v Crusaders game, I've even roped in one of my non-rugby-watching american friends to watch with me. I'm hoping if I explain the rules, and it's an entertaining game, that I might be able to convert him. Pray for me my brothers...
...people like to cry a lot...- Pekka ...we just argue without evidence, secure in our own superiority.- Snotty
Originally posted by Caligastia
I'm really looking forward to the Blues v Crusaders game, I've even roped in one of my non-rugby-watching american friends to watch with me. I'm hoping if I explain the rules, and it's an entertaining game, that I might be able to convert him.
If there are any local clubs and he's interested, try to get him to play. That's how I got to love the game, by running with the ball and tackling.
According to the report you linked to, the two replacement players were a prop and a hooker! All very bizarre.
It resulted in a situation where one prop and two hookers were on the field. One of those Hookers (Azam) can and has played prop but was less than forthcoming on the fact shall we say. Anyway it’s a dead duck – the RFU met for three hours yesterday and decided on balance that there was not quite sufficient grounds to overturn the result. Tigers have 48 hours to appeal but the club has said we are unlikely to. For all the criticism we get from other supporters we do have a history of ‘taking it on the chin’. I’m not sure I personally would be so kind – as I say I have no problem with what occurs between the 44 men who may be on the field – chicanery is part of the game after all – but a side that avoids the very bnature of the game by avoiding scrums without cause is a different matter. I don’t think Gloucester have emerged looking very good from this? Best team in the country? The jury is very much out on that. Best coached? Thats a safer bet.
I look forward to Steve Lander’s next visit to Welford Road
I genuinely think that's a perfectly appropriate means of dealing with the matter
See the above – I think that’s what the club is looking for. The way our forwards buckled down and started to work them over after the tries were leaked I have good reason to feel optimistic should we make the final.
So, in that tournament, a team requiring an uncontested scrum automatically loses the match? I don't believe it. But if it's true - then the law wasn't followed. Very very strange.
Smacks of ‘Shamateurism’ still does it not?
No, he wasn't bald. Couldn't of been Martin Johnson.
Difficult to know what to say here Bearcat!
I'm sure I'll remember what you said if and when the Eagles ever beat the Wallabies
You know what Finbar – I like this guy. Good attitude.
Needless to say a well known supporter of the Wallabies would explain you have beaten a B Team.
I think Finbar has only ever hinted at that in regards to the ABs last year. I recall him being quite critical of the Wallabies after the Ireland game?
I'm hoping if I explain the rules, and it's an entertaining game, that I might be able to convert him. Pray for me my brothers...
Always happy to support such a noble cause.
That's how I got to love the game, by running with the ball and tackling.
Ah it was similar for me too. Minus the running part.
It is better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt
No, he wasn't bald. Couldn't of been Martin Johnson.
No, J****'s not bald. Just lantern-jawed and on the dim side.
In any case, I'm sure I'll remember what you said if and when the Eagles ever beat the Wallabies
Could be very soon the way our Super 12 teams are playing!
" ... and the following morning I should see the Boks wallop the Wallabies again?" - Havak "The only thing worse than being quoted in someone's sig is not being quoted in someone's sig." - finbar, with apologies to Oscar Wilde.
Needless to say a well known supporter of the Wallabies would explain you have beaten a B Team.
" ... and the following morning I should see the Boks wallop the Wallabies again?" - Havak "The only thing worse than being quoted in someone's sig is not being quoted in someone's sig." - finbar, with apologies to Oscar Wilde.
Originally posted by Havak
It resulted in a situation where one prop and two hookers were on the field. One of those Hookers (Azam) can and has played prop but was less than forthcoming on the fact shall we say.
A-ha. One prop and two hookers. That situation arose in S12 either last season or the season before. The scrum was contested. It does depend on the experience - and courage - of the spare hooker. A certain Les Bleus supporter, of course, would explain that differentiating between contested and uncontested scrums in the SH scrum is the ultimate definition of splitting straws.
For all the criticism we get from other supporters we do have a history of ?taking it on the chin?.
Not often enough. Oh! You were writing metaphorically ... Sorry! As you were.
Smacks of ?Shamateurism? still does it not?
Smacks of nonsense to me. Unless, eons ago, a team could lose a match because of an uncontested scrum. I can't believe it, though.
Difficult to know what to say here Bearcat!
I had no problem finding something to say in reply.
You know what Finbar ? I like this guy. Good attitude.
Learning too fast for my liking!
I think Finbar has only ever hinted at that in regards to the ABs last year. I recall him being quite critical of the Wallabies after the Ireland game?
Hinted? An entire second-string scrum packs down? And, despite your claim - statistically - to have pushed them off the park, the onfield evidence was to the contrary. Be that as it may, I did pay out on the Wallabies after the Ireland game. They deserved it. I've since seen a mini-doco on the NH tour. S. Larkham explained away the Irish debacle on the basis that the defence coach had been drilling new moves into the team and the team got confused. Spare me, please!
Ah it was similar for me too. Minus the running part.
I wish you hadn't written that. I now shan't sleep tonight for fear of closing my eyes and seeing Havak hauling himself around the paddock!
" ... and the following morning I should see the Boks wallop the Wallabies again?" - Havak "The only thing worse than being quoted in someone's sig is not being quoted in someone's sig." - finbar, with apologies to Oscar Wilde.
Originally posted by finbar
A certain Les Bleus supporter, of course, would explain that differentiating between contested and uncontested scrums in the SH scrum is the ultimate definition of splitting straws.
Hey! This is my job to hit you with the stick you have handled me.
Smacks of nonsense to me. Unless, eons ago, a team could lose a match because of an uncontested scrum. I can't believe it, though.
In this case shame should kill! I would have no qualms at declaring the game lost for Gloucester as what they have done is like cheating.
I am really angry because the grotesque behaviour of these fools are killing the game of Rugby. In the French Championship, two clubs have already used this trick to avoid a loss this year (and one is Montferrand which we can consider as my Gloucester though the place of most disliked club in France is now contested by Agen and the pitiful spirit of its supporters). There are more and more reports about uncontested scrums in the various championships and it is really a shame. In the Six Nations Tournament the SH referees (and Mr Honiss ahead of the others) are clearly hindering, if not preventing, the scrum work. In the S12 and the Tri-Nations the scrums are almost uncontested since a few years now and the leaders of the NH unions are defending the scrum with the vigor and the speed of a snail.
I don't want our game to become a crossover between Rugby and L*****.
Learning too fast for my liking!
Come on Bearcat, this means you are on the good path...
Hinted? An entire second-string scrum packs down? And, despite your claim - statistically - to have pushed them off the park, the onfield evidence was to the contrary.
See Bearcat, you have ten years to prepare yourself though you have an advantage over Havak, and only a half one over Caligastia, as you are not English...
I wish you hadn't written that. I now shan't sleep tonight for fear of closing my eyes and seeing Havak hauling himself around the paddock!
Fear? I would have thought you would rather burst out laughing...
"Democracy is the worst form of government there is, except for all the others that have been tried." Sir Winston Churchill
No, J****'s not bald. Just lantern-jawed and on the dim side.
The guy reportedly has a keen analytical mind.
It does depend on the experience - and courage - of the spare hooker
But here is the thing – the initial hooker was the one with propping experience –surely the hooker who came on could have ‘hooked’ whilst the incumbent moved to prop?
differentiating between contested and uncontested scrums in the SH scrum is the ultimate definition of splitting straws.
Not often enough. Oh! You were writing metaphorically ... Sorry! As you were.
You are really on form today.
Smacks of nonsense to me. Unless, eons ago, a team could lose a match because of an uncontested scrum. I can't believe it, though.
Anything is possible in the murky past of British rugger. But the regs should have been read more carefully recently that is for sure.
I had no problem finding something to say in reply.
But something with a grain of truth would have been nice.
Learning too fast for my liking!
Yes, definitely showing promise.
An entire second-string scrum packs down? And, despite your claim - statistically - to have pushed them off the park, the onfield evidence was to the contrary.
Okay, so it was a STRONG hint then.
Onfield ‘evidence’ is a tricky thing – we had nearly two thirds of the ball and that’s something tangible in black and white. You might then rightfully criticise us for not utilising it much.
S. Larkham explained away the Irish debacle on the basis that the defence coach had been drilling new moves into the team and the team got confused. Spare me, please!
A classic example of a team not taking it on the chin perhaps?
I now shan't sleep tonight for fear of closing my eyes and seeing Havak hauling himself around the paddock!
It’s a justifiably scary image.
In this case shame should kill! I would have no qualms at declaring the game lost for Gloucester as what they have done is like cheating.
I could argue they hate us so much, and are so jealous of our recent success that they would feel no shame had they fielded 30 men to beat us.
Maybe the scrums do need looking at again. I’m not sure I should comment on Mr Honiss again though? I thought some of our scrums against the SH sides in November were fiercely contested in actual fact. I think they realised it was not an aspect of the game to ignore against us.
I don't want our game to become a crossover between Rugby and L*****.
And there of course is the fear we face with these scrum machinations by coaches.
See Bearcat, you have ten years to prepare yourself though you have an advantage over Havak, and only a half one over Caligastia, as you are not English...
Until such time as your forwards become as good as ours or France’s at which time Finbar will try to subvert their superiority with what I would call ‘rose-tinted recall’ as above.
On the other hand he will no doubt accuse me of exactly the same, at which point I have to reply – England won!
There – saved loads of time.
Fear? I would have thought you would rather burst out laughing...
Only those with a life saving turn of pace ever dared to laugh. Those without that, or with poor side steps, tended to see the serious side of things. And from a radically new perspective.
It is better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt
Originally posted by Tamerlin
Hey! This is my job to hit you with the stick you have handled me.
Watch out for splinters!
In the S12 and the Tri-Nations the scrums are almost uncontested since a few years now
Encore une fois!
Come on Bearcat, this means you are on the good path...
I think it's time stopped being kind to Bearcat and dealt with him as brutally as we deal with each other!
Fear? I would have thought you would rather burst out laughing...
You're quite right. Imagine having to change the sheets in the middle of the night.
" ... and the following morning I should see the Boks wallop the Wallabies again?" - Havak "The only thing worse than being quoted in someone's sig is not being quoted in someone's sig." - finbar, with apologies to Oscar Wilde.
But here is the thing ? the initial hooker was the one with propping experience ?surely the hooker who came on could have ?hooked? whilst the incumbent moved to prop?
Well, indeed. Sounds like a put-up job, which is a pity.
You are really on form today.
A bit liverish. One of my heirloom tomato seedlings keeled over and died. Ungrateful bastard of a thing!
But something with a grain of truth would have been nice.
Precedents are dangerous things to set.
Onfield ?evidence? is a tricky thing ? we had nearly two thirds of the ball and that?s something tangible in black and white. You might then rightfully criticise us for not utilising it much.
Yes, indeed, so I win the argument either way.
Maybe the scrums do need looking at again. I?m not sure I should comment on Mr Honiss again though? I thought some of our scrums against the SH sides in November were fiercely contested in actual fact. I think they realised it was not an aspect of the game to ignore against us.
I don't know about north of the equator, but this season's S12 is seeing the refs - as well as very strictly policing the tackler rolling away and entering "through the gate" behind the last feet - also cracking down on the front row activities. They're getting one warning about pushing before the ball is in before they're penalised. They're getting one warning about going in straight and level - rather than angled and upwards - before they're penalised. I'm sure it's all coming from the IRB in preparation for the WRC. And the refs, obviously, are performing to the letter of the IRB law because they want brownie points towards getting a reffing gig in the WRC.
Only those with a life saving turn of pace ever dared to laugh. Those without that, or with poor side steps, tended to see the serious side of things. And from a radically new perspective.
SCENE: A muddy paddock somewhere deep in rural Leicester.
CAST: HAVAK, HIS COACH
COACH: "Hey Havak! Run! The play's fifty yards away!"
HAVAK: "If I wait here long enough it'll come back this way!"
" ... and the following morning I should see the Boks wallop the Wallabies again?" - Havak "The only thing worse than being quoted in someone's sig is not being quoted in someone's sig." - finbar, with apologies to Oscar Wilde.
On a sour note - Blues' lock Troy Flavell was suspended for 3 months for stomping an opponent's head last weekend. He could - and should - have got 12 months or more. I watched another replay of the incident last night. The opponent tripped and fell in a maul. With the ball nowhere near them, Flavell waited till the opponent had hit the ground before he proceeded to stamp half a dozen times on the opponent's unprotected head and only stopped when the other players intervened. The opponent was left gashed and bleeding. I've seen Troy Flavell do - and try to do - this before. The sooner he's out of the game the better.
" ... and the following morning I should see the Boks wallop the Wallabies again?" - Havak "The only thing worse than being quoted in someone's sig is not being quoted in someone's sig." - finbar, with apologies to Oscar Wilde.
Originally posted by finbar
Watch out for splinters!
Don't be so preposterous your head is not so hard that the stick will split unto it...
Encore une fois!
This is the Southern Hemisphere Scrum Waltz... play it again sam!
I think it's time stopped being kind to Bearcat and dealt with him as brutally as we deal with each other!
Ye ar' dam' right, ze next rezults of the Eagles will giv' us ze opportunity to show him we're naughty boys.
Spit...
Ding!
You're quite right. Imagine having to change the sheets in the middle of the night.
You have been warned, you will see life differently when you will have only one eye to look at it when your other eye will be closed right after a hooker's punch.
On a sour note - Blues' lock Troy Flavell was suspended for 3 months for stomping an opponent's head last weekend. He could - and should - have got 12 months or more. I watched another replay of the incident last night. The opponent tripped and fell in a maul. With the ball nowhere near them, Flavell waited till the opponent had hit the ground before he proceeded to stamp half a dozen times on the opponent's unprotected head and only stopped when the other players intervened. The opponent was left gashed and bleeding. I've seen Troy Flavell do - and try to do - this before. The sooner he's out of the game the better.
This kind of players, like the infamous SA forward I have forgotten the name, should be permanently banned by their respective federations. I really don't understand why they are allowed to play Rugby again.
I don't know about north of the equator, but this season's S12 is seeing the refs - as well as very strictly policing the tackler rolling away and entering "through the gate" behind the last feet - also cracking down on the front row activities. They're getting one warning about pushing before the ball is in before they're penalised. They're getting one warning about going in straight and level - rather than angled and upwards - before they're penalised. I'm sure it's all coming from the IRB in preparation for the WRC. And the refs, obviously, are performing to the letter of the IRB law because they want brownie points towards getting a reffing gig in the WRC.
The referees of the Six Nations Tournament have also been given similar instructions though the ones coming from the SH are also striving to hinder the pushes in the scrums. Are the instructions similar in the SH...
HAVAK: "If I wait here long enough it'll come back this way!"
"Democracy is the worst form of government there is, except for all the others that have been tried." Sir Winston Churchill
Be that as it may, I did pay out on the Wallabies after the Ireland game. They deserved it. I've since seen a mini-doco on the NH tour. S. Larkham explained away the Irish debacle on the basis that the defence coach had been drilling new moves into the team and the team got confused. Spare me, please! 
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