"Turkey has the second largest number of troops in the NATO alliance"

[SpencerH]

Originally posted by Oerdin
When I was serving in Kosovo with the U.S. Army I got a chance to work with soldiers from a number of different countries both inside NATO and outside NATO. The Turks favorably impressed me; they looked like professional soldiers. I don't know if they would have been an effective fighting force but they dressed well, marched well, and their soldiers certainly had military discipline.

I can’t say I was as impressed by the Greek garrison in Kosovo. I don’t question the individual soldier’s valor and the greeks did have modern NATO weaponry but the officers seemed to be very laxed with the enlisted. This meant some of the enlisted got away with sleeping while on guard duty and many of them didn’t put any effort into wearing their uniforms properly. Of course this could have just been how one commanding officer ran things and other Greek units might be totally different but this is the only Greek unit which I have ever worked with.

Speaking of the Greek company’s commanding officer he was without a doubt the absolutely FATEST military officer I have ever seen. I mean he was easily over 300 pounds (and only about 5 foot 9 inches tall)! Even his own soldiers had taken to calling him “fat bastard” while other officers and NCOs were around. Still the guy knew how to party; I’ll never forget going the Orthodox new year celibration he throw. Everyone got hammered on Ouzo and then started dancing on the tables and breaking dishes agaisnt the wall. They even finished it off by firing their pistols into the air! The poor villages across the street must have been scared stiff!

My experiences with Turk and Greek soldiers are similar (although 20 years earlier). We respected the Turk soldiers. So did Chesty Puller BTW, who saw them in action in Korea. He mentions their toughness and fondness for the bayonet in his (semi) auto-biography "Marine"

[Ted Striker]

Hi Lancer,

This is derek, I tried to private message you but your mailbox is full. (I think that it's always like that for some reason).

[Ted Striker]

By the way, I saw the news story last week about Turkey threatening NAFTA as an alternative to the EU. Personally I think this would be the best move in the history of trade as it would grant us easier access to the hottest women in the world.

[Dinner]

Turkish women are the hottest in the world? I always thought of them as being a bit on the hairy side but to each his own I guess...

[Ted Striker]

You're confusing them with the Greeks.

[Dinner]

The hairst woman I have ever seen is without a doubt an Armenian girl my friend went out with while we were in college. He swares she asked him out other wise he wouldn't have given her a second thought but the fact remains he sh@gged a chick who had a back hairier then Chubacka!

Personally I go for the Scandinavian look; tall, blond, and thin with HUGE tits.

[Ted Striker]

Did she make sex noises like Chewy?

Actually, a long time ago paiktis posted something that said that Turkish women spend more money on hair removal products than any other people.

My favorites are the middle eastern women, plus I like their culture the best. It is a shame all those Persian and Iraqi women are locked down.

[Ned]

paiktis and serb, we really got to heal the schism between East and West. The pope already apologized for 1204. What more do you need?

Anyhow, the US is officially religious-neutral and we have a large number of Orthodox in this country. That should count for something, shouldn't it?

Perhaps we should send Kissinger with an olive branch.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Ned
Perhaps we should send Kissinger with an olive branch.

Ned: If your going to send Kissinger just make sure there aren't any bombers on stand by first.

T.S.: Thankfully they were both discrete so I never had to find out exactly how far the Chewy analogy went. We did leave a bottle of nair (hair removal gel) on his night stand once. He was supposed to find it before she got there but when they walked in together she saw it and got kind of hurt feelings.

She was a nice person even if she left more hair in the shower then the four guys who lived there put together.

[axi]

Nationalism seems to be a necessary stage in the evolution of the capitalist system. It is intertwined with the expansion of the dominance of a certain class of capitalists over land and people and the securing of influence zones, vital spaces where each individual capitalist class has can grow unhindered by competition. Once one capitalist state becomes developped enough, it comes out of the closet and tries to take over other economies, by money or by force and enters it's imperialist stage. This parallel advancement of rival elites is what is leading to nationalistic wars and creates the imerialist chain, where each country has it's place according to it's strength.

Greek capital was the first to advance in the nationalist stage in the Balkans, so Greece (along with Serbia) was the first state to emerge out of the Ottoman empire. It's policy was definitely expansionist, until it reached the maximum it's population dynamics and the interests of the greater powers allowed. Yet the most important factor that halted the Greek imperialist expansion in 1922 was the emergence of Turkish nationalism in 1908 which hastened the conflict in the area and led to gains for the Greeks and other Balkan nations, until the Turkish recovery. Albania, as the most backward nation of the area, did not go through that stage at that time and is going through it nowdays. Hopefully it is still the underdog of the region and will not cause any real trouble until it gets through the phase.

The Turks have been traditionally devout soldiers and the military is the prime element of their culture. I am not impressed that they are better soldiers than we are. Paiktis would say that they are, compared to us, abyssmal seamen and and airmen. He would say that the Greek navy has had the honour to be the only navy in the world that has never lowered it's flag to admit defeat from an enemy.

Personally, I am not at all jealous of the Turks or proud of our own military prowess, since the greatness of nations is truly found in their culture. I feel that a country that has too many soldiers is primarily hurting itself rather that it's enemies.

[Shi Huangdi]

"As for The Asian Minor thing, noone gets it doen correctly the first time.

Rugclothed Greeks against an empire and still we went all the way to their capital. "

Need to brush up on your history, Paitkis? Hardly the first time, Turkey had already been in two wars against modern Greece, the Greek War of Independence and the First Balkan War. Those "rugclothed Greeks" were veteran troops that had just been victorious in a world war. Ataturk's forces were what he had built together from his original guerilla movement. The Greeks weren't against an empire, the Ottoman gov. in Istanbul was basically a puppet regime, Ataturk's forces were republicans. And again, you did get to Ankara, but you got knocked all the way back.

"Now, either with arms or with their forced democratization western Turkey will again be populated by Greeks. the drive is too strong. "

Not likely. In addition to the Turkish military, any agression would also mean facing US and Israeli military forces. Meaning you lose.

"Personally, I am not at all jealous of the Turks or proud of our own military prowess, since the greatness of nations is truly found in their culture. "

Well Football is the most important element of European culturea, and given Turkey's recent performance in the world cup in which they were the third best team in the world, and Greece didn't even qualify, I wouln't say Greece is too far ahead of Turkey culturally......

[Bereta_Eder]

a few thousand ragclothed Greeks against an empire of 70 millions and still all the way to the capital.

Now Greece better than ever. Turkey in ruins.

Through arms or forced democratization Greeks return to Asia Minor.

And good job on the football Turkey

This is not culture though.

Good luck on the Athens Olympiad 2004 too.

As for perturbated black irish Shi, Osama and Happy New year as you tremble in fear of terror attacks.

[Dinner]

Let's face it Paitis. Both Turkey and Greece will be friends and co-members of the EU soon. Or at least co-members of the EU so all the Greeces that want to go back will have a legal right to do so since the EU allows the free movement of people with in its borders.

Since the rest of Europe's economy is so much better I would expect to find more Turks heading west then Greeks heading east. Time will tell though.

[Bereta_Eder]

You are probably right. With one exception.

Turks will chose economies far better than ours to go to inside the EU.


Which is the reason why they will never get inside the EU. - Although they will be forced to become more democratic. Which is good.

Or else go back to islamism and you coming to constantinople to protect it.

things are good