Well, i'll be...

[GePap]

Incredible:

12 israeli settlers killed in heborn, and not one thread about it already? Wonder why?

Well, it seems rather normal that this would eventually be brought up.

First, condolences to the relative of the dead.

We will see how nasty the public sponsored revenge attacks for this act will be. Most rational thing would be, while the ones responsible are being sought, to secure the lives of the 450+ nationalist and relegious fanatics that live among 130,000 Paletinians by moving them out of Hebron and into Israel itself. Of course, this ain't going to happen. Instead 130,000 peole will be put under house arrest by the Israeli army: someplace in gaza will be be bombed, and then, when these settlers decide to take their own private revenge against the Palestinians, the Israeli authorities will look the other way. How typical.

Well, reuglar comments sought. I mean, this is a ME thread, so I expect nothing other than the ususal.

[Dom Pedro II]

Why is it that the send in the military every time something happens? Why not the police? Wouldn't a show of justice rather than a show of force be better to try and establish good will?

[GePap]

Well, the problem is that Israeli police have no jurisdiction in hebron, so they could not go in. Besides, the Israeli government doesn't particularly want to inspire good-will. they prefer to inspire fear, since most Israelis think that Arabs hate them period, and thus all they can do is beat them hard enough so that they won't act on this inate hatred israelis think exists.

[Dom Pedro II]

I think I would learn to hate someone if they used my house as a barracks for most of the year.

[Kingof the Apes]

And if they blew up buses.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by GePap
since most Israelis think that Arabs hate them period,

I wonder why they'd think that?

[Felch]

Yeah, gosh, the Arabs seem to be peaceful people who only occasionally murder civilians. And then cheer about it and pass out candy to children to celebrate. Certainly not hateful bigots.

[GePap]

Yeah, after all, look at how those hateful Egyptians and Jordanians refuse to make peace with israel! bastards! You can never trust an Arab state, far less the biggest Arab state, to even make peace with israel!

Oh yeah, and we can never forget the peaceful attitude of israelis! They have always shown nothing but compasion and a whish to live peacefully with their Arab neighbors: Those Palestinians villages in 1948-49 burned themselves down. Oh yeah, and the Hundreads of thousands of people made refugees in 1948-1967simply happened auomatically, with the Israelis doing nothing. Oh, and the indefinite holding of prisioners and their torture, that breeds nothing but good will. And of course we know how much the Lebanese should love the Israelis, as well as the palestinians. I mean, how can anyone blame israeli for the 2000+ Palestinians civilains killed by indescrimate bombing of settlemenst in march 1978, or who could probably feel any pain over the 15,000 people killed when israeli invaded in 1982, an bombed Beirut? 15,000 is hardly a sufficent number to make up for the 240 odd israelis killed by Palestinian terrorism from 1950-1982. think of it, 240 people in 32 years, and Arabs have the gaul to care about 15,000! Oh, and sabra and Shatilla: the IDF had nothing to do with that! i mean, all they did was surround the camp, control who came in and got out, give the Christian militias their guns and uniforms and radios. How can they ever get any blame for the deaths of 1500+ (acording to the international committee of the Red Cross) peole there!

Yes, you Felch X and Oerdin are right! The 650 Jews killed in the last 2 years, plsu the 800 odd killed by terrorism in the previous 50 show how evil the Arabs are. The 20,000 Arabs killed in response by israel should show the world whos the good guy and whos the bad guy, right! Who want war and who wants to establish peaceful relations. I mean, it was israel that moved to srike peace with Egypt, no?..and Jordan?



Edit: You guys are nothing but ignorant and biggoted fools. Both sides are wrong, and both sides have been wrong since 1948. At least I have the sense to look at the entire historical record. It isn't pretty, but it sure as hell helps to get a better picture. But I am sorry if I unfortunitelly have brought up something so terrible as facts into the mix. I know how much that may offend you two.

[Ming]

Originally posted by GePap
Edit: You guys are nothing but ignorant and biggoted fools.

And you are one more personal insult away from getting restricted. Discuss the issues... not attack other people.

[Eli]

The 500 settlers among 130,000 Arabs in Hebron are no different from the 5mil Israelis among 1bil Muslims.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Ming
And you are one more personal insult away from getting restricted. Discuss the issues... not attack other people.

I am sorry if I get emotional.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Eli
The 500 settlers among 130,000 Arabs in Hebron are no different from the 5mil Israelis among 1bil Muslims.

Hardly the same, Eli.

[Eli]

Hardly the same, Eli.

You are right. The Hebron settlers have more right to be there than the Israelis in Israel. Hebron had a big Jewish presence even during the years of the exile, unlike most of Israel.
Until the Jews there were massacred in 1929... They refused to accept help from the Hagana because they thought it would hurt the good relations with the Arabs.

[Giancarlo]

Gepap, what do you know about having suicide bombers blow themselves up in your neighborhood? I would wait and see what the Israeli posters have to say about this. That in my opinion is probably the most honest answer you could get.

You are definitely anti-Israeli, and one of those pro-Palestinian types... I would examine which side you are supporting.

[GePap]

Eli:

As i have said before, I don't care about 'historical rights' since I don't believe they exist. History owes one nothing. Rights are to individuals, not to ethnic groups. I know of the 1929 massacre, bu the fact that there were jews in Hebron gives the settlers no more right to live where they do than it would give palestinians to demand that they be given a neighborhood in Jaffa becaue that used to be an Arab city for a millenium.
The foundation of Israel did bring up many issue about right and wrong: but to me those are mute points, since israeli is now a recognized state. Once you are reconized as part of the iternational community, the issue of birth is no longer relevant. the issue of behavior and following the rules of the international community continue to be.

Fez:

I have never seen a horrible thing in person, but I must say that the pictures of the aftremath of suicide bombings to me is no more horrible at all than pictures form the Holocaust, rwanda, any other terrorist site, ambodia, so forth and so on. And thay don't matter to me either. It may be hard, but the horros of the ast must always be overcome to create a bettre future.

If the tutsi of rwanda and the hutu of rwanda, who live in a small area, as small as israel, with as many players (8 million people in Rwanda in 1994, 9 million in Israel and the territories) can ba asked to put back their extremely poor state after a bout of violence that lead to more deaths and more refugees in 3 years than the last 52 of Israeli-Arab disputes, then why can far richer societies that have seen far less dramatic and horrific acts be thought to be incapable? To me that is non-sensical.