What is your race?

[One_Brow]

Originally posted by ranskaldan
JohnM2433:
I think that's an answer for you, right there.

But a question for people who don't believe in race: What do you term the geographically-related, pretty obvious genetic differences between people then?

Skin color. There is no other feature that is "pretty obvious" and is also geographically related. Any other features (hair thickness and density, nose shape, etc.) are quite wide-spread geographically.

[Thrawn05]

Originally posted by ranskaldan


?????

Please refer to the chart I posted.

Iranians speak an Indo-European language, their origins are Indo-European, even today their genetics cluster with Europeans... what more do you need?!

You missed Latin.


Okay, after PAINFULLY reading this thread, I have decided to decalre Political Correctness an evil that MUST be destroyed. I declare war on PC! All those who shove PC in my face must DIE!!!

Get OVER IT people, welcome to the real world.

Have a Nice day (TM)

[JohnM2433]

Originally posted by paiktis22
This thread is funny.

It is about the insecurity of some people who want to portray themselves as "white".

On what do you base that conclusion? I'm "white", and I didn't think this thread had anything to do with my insecurities.

Are you under the impression that everyone defending the concept of race feels honored to be of European heritage?

****: Listen; do any of you remember why we all decided that we were going to be white when we came to this planet?
There is a brief pause as the aliens think this over.
HARRY: I seem to recall that I chose white because it would be cooler in the summer.
SALLY: No, ****, don't you remember? All the people we saw on the television broadcasts coming from this planet were white.
****: Well, I have bad news. Apparently we've unwittingly allied ourselves with the most destructive, violent, ruthless force on the planet!
SALLY: Bummer!
- "3rd Rock From the Sun" (quoted as best I can recall)

[JohnM2433]

Arg. That's a common name; does it really need to be censored?

That reminds me of when I played Ultima Online; the game would censor things like "***umption" (in its words). After a while I just turned the damn swear filter off.

[JohnM2433]

*Sigh*. As I expected, "damn" made it through. It figures, doesn't it?

[ranskaldan]

Originally posted by One_Brow


Skin color. There is no other feature that is "pretty obvious" and is also geographically related. Any other features (hair thickness and density, nose shape, etc.) are quite wide-spread geographically.

Your argument about hair thickness, nose shape etc also applies to skin color. Any shade of skin color is also "widespread".

But on the other hand, you have just expressed opposition to any form of scientific classification. Any trait of any organism, element, or whatever is widespread.

[One_Brow]

Originally posted by ranskaldan
Your argument about hair thickness, nose shape etc also applies to skin color. Any shade of skin color is also "widespread".

While you can find there are varying degrees of pigmentation worldwide, it is also true that the specific color of a more heavily pigmented native in Zimbabwe will be different from the color of the native in Vietnam, and true that the specific color of a less heavily pigmented native in Norway will be different from the color of the native in Manchuria.

But on the other hand, you have just expressed opposition to any form of scientific classification. Any trait of any organism, element, or whatever is widespread.

My understanding of scientific classification, with regard to biology, was that it was intended to measure evolutionary relationsips, not specific traits. In those terms, all the imagined races are of a single evolutionary group, and no further classification is needed.

[aaglo]

hmph...

There are only two different races: those who believe in different races, and those who don't.

[Guardian]

Hehe... well, in that case, I suppose I could be counted amongst the latter (hence didn't bother to vote).

Who the hell cares what race I am anyway??

[Viking Berserk]

Originally posted by paiktis22
This thread is funny.

It is about the insecurity of some people who want to portray themselves as "white".

WHy on earth this is important or how it helps them deal with their insecurities is beyond me.

But do carry on

Insecurities? explain what ur talking about

[JohnM2433]

Originally posted by JohnM2433
Are you under the impression that everyone defending the concept of race feels honored to be of European heritage?

More to the point, do you assume that everyone who isn't offended by this thread is "white"? Even more to the point, did I make that assumption when I posted the above? Arg. How did I not catch that?

Originally posted by One_Brow
While you can find there are varying degrees of pigmentation worldwide, it is also true that the specific color of a more heavily pigmented native in Zimbabwe will be different from the color of the native in Vietnam, and true that the specific color of a less heavily pigmented native in Norway will be different from the color of the native in Manchuria.

Couldn't you say the same thing about many other traits?

Originally posted by One_Brow
My understanding of scientific classification, with regard to biology, was that it was intended to measure evolutionary relationsips, not specific traits. In those terms, all the imagined races are of a single evolutionary group, and no further classification is needed.

It was my understanding that the whole concept of different homo sapiens races is based on the assumption that groups of humans developed more or less genetically isolated from each other for long periods of time. Doesn't it make sense to think of genetically isolated subpopulations of a species as separate "evolutionary groups"?

[One_Brow]

Originally posted by JohnM2433

Originally posted by One_Brow
While you can find there are varying degrees of pigmentation worldwide, it is also true that the specific color of a more heavily pigmented native in Zimbabwe will be different from the color of the native in Vietnam, and true that the specific color of a less heavily pigmented native in Norway will be different from the color of the native in Manchuria.

Couldn't you say the same thing about many other traits?

Anything is possible. Do you have specific traits in mind?

It was my understanding that the whole concept of different homo sapiens races is based on the assumption that groups of humans developed more or less genetically isolated from each other for long periods of time. Doesn't it make sense to think of genetically isolated subpopulations of a species as separate "evolutionary groups"?

If there were genetically isolated populations, then it might make sense. However, outside of a very recent and short-lived Old World/New World separation, there have not been such genetic isolations. Genes may have traveled slowly, and not every gene is found everywhere. In some cases, there might even be gene mutations that did not make it past a very local, family/clan disbursment. However, any gene that could be identified as having a high preponderance across a supposed race also appears in the population of the other supposed races.

For example, in sub-Saharan Aftrica there is a definite advantage to having heavily pigmented skin. This lead to their being a definite survival advantage for the genes causing this skin. Nonetheless, there is and apparently always has been a small amount of several of the genes that lead to lighter skin color.

[Viking Berserk]

Originally posted by aaglo
hmph...

There are only two different races: those who believe in different races, and those who don't.

I would rather characterize it in:

Indo-European
Semittic
Black
Asian
Native American
Oceanians (?)

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by Viking Berserk

Oceanians (?)

So I'm not a white New Zealander, I'm an Oceanian!

[ranskaldan]

Indo-European
Semittic
Black
Asian
Native American
Oceanians (?)

you're still going to distinguish Indo-Europeans and Semites??

Are you saying that the average Kurd and the average Swede are more genetically similar than the average Kurd and the average Syrian?

And I think you missed a few ethnicities that are VERY different from those you listed:
Khoisan
Dravidian
Papuan
Australian Aborigine
Pygmy
Nilotic (?)

All these diverge far more than Native Americans diverge from Asians, or I-Es diverge from Semites.