World's Cultural Capital

[Pandemoniak]

yeah thats right, though all the I Paris havent been sold yet

[Pandemoniak]

Sir Ralph, you're right, but with the globalization, the cultures are tending to get closer to each other.

[SpencerH]

Cultural capital is way too broad a concept. I voted based on the current promulgation of that cities (regions) particular culture throughout the world.


The winner, hands down, is LA.

[Harovan]

Well, at least what concerns quantity, nothing can match LA's output, even though the quality of most of it's "culture" is near zero. It's industrial production of "culture" and aims not to create something of eternal worth, but merely quick money.

It can be compared with the painter, who produces cheap portraits, still lives and landscapes en masse and sells them well to the masses. He can get rich this way, but in 20 years he will be forgotten. Compare this with the great painters in history. They often died in poverty, but are remembered through centuries.

[Datajack Franit]

Still can't understand how someone whose greatest artwork was a picture of a pile of canned soup can be even called an artist

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by SpencerH
Cultural capital is way too broad a concept. I voted based on the current promulgation of that cities (regions) particular culture throughout the world.


The winner, hands down, is LA.

Were all cities becoming like LA, I'd agree...but that's not the case. LA is the only LA. The culture LA promulgates is not LA culture. In fact, a lot of it is NY culture. Promulgating culture, IMO, means you're making other cities adopt your lifestyle. That's not what LA is doing (thank god).

I think NY is still the winner here. Cities around the world strive to be like NY more than any other town. It is held as the quintessential metropolis, where art, theater, film, literature, etc. all thrive in a very small geographic area. There is a reason why, moreso than any other city, NY is the setting in books, TV, and films.

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Pandemoniak

quote:
* Pandemoniak laughs his ass out

I think you managed to laugh it into your post.

You ignored my point. Completely.

It doesn't matter who influenced American directors. It matters what culture is in the films that influence the world and since American films are the ones that get watched world wide to a larger degree than any others its American culture that is influenceing and changing people. Why the heck do you think there are complaints about American cultural influence?

Anyway, if you want to know how many filmgoers had their lives influenced by Eisenstein, you have first to klnow that at the very beginning of cinematic grammar,

The very beginning was in silents and that started in the US. Obviously the French had a lot of influence there in the change from the garbage that was originally produced but they and other Europeans were not the only influence.

At this point, there was a large circulation of ideas and cinematic experiments, and what REALLY made the difference was Cecil B. DeMille. His innovations have been really implemented by directors such as Lang, who fled Europe in the late twenties and early thirties and thus worked in america.

Thus making films with American culture.

All that is quite basic, but to sum up, the cinematic grammar has been created in Europe, and spread by america.

Its not the grammer its the culture in the films that influence the culture of filmgoers. Hollywood steals from everywhere. Buys directors too. Like Lang.

And to answer your question, how many american filmmakers havent been overwhelmed by the cultural influence of Eisenstein ? Hardly none.

Affected yes. Overwhelmed? You gotta be kidding. Orson Wells' Citizen Cane is as influential.

Well, you seem to ignore the definition of Classic Hollywoodian films, concerning films made in the late 40's and 50's. My fingers are tired to type, go get a good book on film history and film genres.

I don't care what definition you use. Hollywood spread American culture not Russian nor French. Hollywood is certainly not limited to the 40s and 50s. It did hit a dead spot in the late 50s and for most of the 60s. TV seems to have been the cause of that.

[SpencerH]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov

Were all cities becoming like LA, I'd agree...but that's not the case. LA is the only LA. The culture LA promulgates is not LA culture. In fact, a lot of it is NY culture. Promulgating culture, IMO, means you're making other cities adopt your lifestyle. That's not what LA is doing (thank god).

I would disagree even if we were only discussing art and we're not (at least I'm not). The culture that I've personally seen having the most influence is west coast (LA) culture, Dude! We may find it inane, but it's the cultural influence that is complained in about, not Jackson Pollack.

Cities around the world strive to be like NY more than any other town. It is held as the quintessential metropolis, where art, theater, film, literature, etc. all thrive in a very small geographic area. There is a reason why, moreso than any other city, NY is the setting in books, TV, and films.

'Spoken' like a true NYorker. NY is a wonderful city of the arts, but IMO it doesnt beat out London or Paris.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by SpencerH
'Spoken' like a true NYorker. NY is a wonderful city of the arts, but IMO it doesnt beat out London or Paris.

The fact that it is home to both Marvel and DC puts it head and shoulders above both London and Paris, IMO. [/fanboy]

[Harovan]

I can agree with New York as city of the arts (one of many) and LA as the capital of cheap entertainment (almost standalone).

[Boris Godunov]

10 sudden votes for Chicago = Ming cheating in the poll.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by SpencerH
I would disagree even if we were only discussing art and we're not (at least I'm not). The culture that I've personally seen having the most influence is west coast (LA) culture, Dude! We may find it inane, but it's the cultural influence that is complained in about, not Jackson Pollack.

And I disagree. The urban culture that has spread throughout the U.S. is New York, and it is that culture that most cities try to imitate. LA has one thing, the film industry. And more often than any other place, NY is the setting for most films and TV shows. That right there shows you NY is seen as the cultural center of the U.S. What city is most watched on New Year's eve?

'Spoken' like a true NYorker. NY is a wonderful city of the arts, but IMO it doesnt beat out London or Paris.

I think it does. Paris and London will always have more history, yes. But in terms of modern culture generation, New York has them both beat. The most prominent writers, thinkers, artists and trend-setters either live in NY or use NY for their cultural springboard.

[rah]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
10 sudden votes for Chicago = Ming cheating in the poll.

Hmmm, not Ming. Obviously you didn't read my post.

RAH

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
10 sudden votes for Chicago = Ming cheating in the poll.

Rah appears to be the culprit. He did mention dead people voting, which is a tradition in Chicago.

[Boris Godunov]

Shame on you for ruining a poster's poll, Dale--er, Rah!

When can we expect a recount?

Oh, and did you notice the request to change the second Chicago? I think it should be Berlin, but others wanted Boston, for some unknown reason.