You are not your aderol.

[Juggernaut]

Damn, that's beautifully said, it could've been the voice-over for Trainspotting II.

Unfortunately, there's no truth behind it.

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Kaak
However, today is seems such drugs are used as an escape from reality more often than because they are actually needed.

1. These drugs are hardly an "escape from reality." Prozac is not cocaine, zoloft is not heroine, etc. In general, taking psychological medication when it isn't needed will make matters worse, not better.

2. What are your sources for your claim here, anyway? How many psychiatrists have you spoken to who have said "Oh, whenever people come in here feeling a bit depressed, we just pump them full of happy pills"? Or how many people have you talked to who have said "Whenever I'm feeling blue, I just pop a couple of Prozacs and float away into dreamland"?

[Kaak]

loin, you obviously don't know much about baylor...half the girls here take their mommies prozac or zoloft when they aren't having a great day...

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Kaak
loin, you obviously don't know much about baylor...half the girls here take their mommies prozac or zoloft when they aren't having a great day...

They're welcome to it, then. Most psych medications have to reach a certain blood concentration level before they start to kick in -- for the stuff I used to take (Depakote and Prozac) it would take a full week before a change in my doseage actually produced any tangible results, and it would take a full month before my blood concentration had levelled out. (Incidentally, the slow effect was the reason that I had to stop taking psych medications -- a particular severe bout of mania or depression would completely overwhelm the effects of the medications, and by the time the medications had been properly adjusted it would be too late for them to do any good.)

[Dauphin]

Whilst I agree in the main with those who say it is not a matter of willing something to be so, I am inclined to subscribe to the power of positive thinking.

If for no other reason than the placebo effect. Make someone think they are being treated and they get better. Obviously drugs are far more effective than placebos, but placebo does work in many (but by no means most) circumstances. (I'm thinking of hypochondria as an example)

[Kepler]

Originally posted by Kaak
bugs, as with all medications, there are those rare individuals who need them. However, today is seems such drugs are used as an escape from reality more often than because they are actually needed. Poor little rich girl isn't having a great day, and mommy gives her some of her zoloft. Then all of a sudden she thinks she needs it. Point is that it seems that people always want to take the easy way out. Suck it up a little and take control.

I'm sorry, I didn't quite catch where you got your degrees in psychiatry, psychology, biochemistry, and internal medicine.

Somebody give this dope diabetes. I'll enjoy seeing him suck it up... right into a coma.

[Kaak]

kepler, like i said, i acknoledge the fact that some people need medication. However, I think far more use it, and become dependant on it than actually needed it in the first place...

[Aeson]

If we aren't affected by chemicals, then why would taking pills matter at all? Even drugs like LSD wouldn't have any affect on us. They are after all just chemicals, which you seem to think don't affect us.

However, I think far more use it, and become dependant on it than actually needed it in the first place...

"I think" isn't very valid evidence either Kaak. Give us some source of numbers to look at that supports your position.

[Kaak]

Aeson, "i think" is valid enough to support the tangent. That was not the point of the post anyway. Let me clarify with an example or two.

1. Chapstick: People use chapstick all the time. Dependancy on chapstick propogates itself. Lips actually become physically addicted to it. The chapstick provides moisture, often too much, so the lips think they need to produce less. After a while, you do actually need the chapstick, because you made yourself dependant on it.
The brain, and the chemicals in the brain work much the same way. That is why Marijuana messes with long term dopamine levels in the brain.

2. *Back to the point of the topic* My car got hit by a drunk driver last saturday. It was parked on the curb, minding its business, and not offending anyone. All of a sudden, someone comes a long and hits it. I didn't see it happen, and the guilty party was gone when i arrived. Classic hit and run. Now, when i saw this, i did not let it ruin my month, my week, or even my night. Granted, it kind of sucks, and it is going to cost me a lot of money to get it fixed, and it hasn't even been 6th months since the last time i got hit by a drunk driver. But hey, these things happen. I chose to keep a positive mind set. And you know what? It wasn't all that hard...

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Kaak
*Back to the point of the topic* My car got hit by a drunk driver last saturday.
...
I chose to keep a positive mind set. And you know what? It wasn't all that hard...

Is that the topic of this thread? "I'm better than all of you turd burglars whose brains don't properly regulate their seratonin/dopamine levels"? You must be awfully proud of yourself for having chosen not to have a genetic defect, Kaak.

Depression is not just "feeling sorry for yourself" -- I call that "moping" or "throwing yourself a pity parade." Depression is "not being able to feel happy, being miserable for no good reason." F'rinstance, for the past three days I've been going through a particularly severe depressive cycle -- the worst I've had in the past 30 months, in fact. I realized that I had gone into a severe depression because I felt absolutely miserable for no reason whatsoever. I wasn't pining over the loss of a pet, or a break-up with a significant other, or the loss of a job, or anything -- in fact, life is going pretty well for me at the moment, but I still feel absolutely miserable no matter what I do. Is this sinking in at all? Are you seeing the difference between your idea of depression (which has absolutely no basis in reality) and the reality of depression that I'm going through? At the moment, I cannot will myself to be happy any more than I can will my heart to stop beating -- my brain is not producing the chemicals necessary for me to feel happy, end of story, not a damn thing I can do about it but wait out the cycle and try to prevent it from feeding on itself. Number of pity parades I've thrown for myself in the past three days? None. Amount of time spent moping over the past three days? None. So **** off with your half-baked amateur psychologist bull****.

[Aeson]

The reason you don't let something 'bad' ruin your day is because you have that ability. If someone doesn't have that ability then they need some sort of help. It could be something that requires just counseling, or it may require medication, or both. Just saying "I think" most people don't require medication makes no point whatsoever, it's just an uninformed opinion unless you have the statistics to back it up. A description as to how free will functions would work as well. Just show that it functions independantly of the chemical makeup of the brain...

I can say that I think mental illness is a widespread, underdiagnosed problem, but I'd rather just show you the numbers.

http://www.nimh.nih.gov/publicat/numbers.cfm

Mental disorders are common in the United States and internationally. An estimated 22.1 percent of Americans ages 18 and older—about 1 in 5 adults—suffer from a diagnosable mental disorder in a given year.1 When applied to the 1998 U.S. Census residential population estimate, this figure translates to 44.3 million people. 2 In addition, 4 of the 10 leading causes of disability in the U.S. and other developed countries are mental disorders-major depression, bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, and obsessive-compulsive disorder. 3 Many people suffer from more than one mental disorder at a given time.

http://www.surgeongeneral.gov/librar...ter2/sec7.html

Slightly more than half of the 15 percent of the adult population that use mental health services have a diagnosable mental or addictive disorder (8 percent), while the remaining portion has a mental health problem (7 percent). Bearing in mind that 28 percent of the population have a diagnosable mental or substance abuse disorder, only about one-third with a diagnosable mental disorder receives treatment in 1 year (Figure 2-5). In short, this translates to the majority of those with a diagnosable mental disorder not receiving treatment.

So roughly 2/3rds of people with a diagnosable mental or substance abuse disorder go without treatment.

[Dr Strangelove]

It's spelled Adderal, and it's a stimulant used in the treatment of ADHD. Many children with ADHD can benefit from behavioral therapy, but you have to have the money and the trained therapists available. Many communities don't have this, so Adderal and Ritalin are substituted. Don't blame the kids. You can expect only so much will power from a seven year old these days. Back in the old days little kids had much more will power, 'cause their will power came from Daddy's belt, the shrubs behind the house, or even a little ol' stick of Louisville's finest Ash.

It's pretty well established that major depression is an inheritable disease. In seperated twin studies the concordance value of major depression has been found to be as high as .90.

[Felch]

I think that for some things we can control how we respond (Getting cut off while driving, failing a pop quiz, et al.), but those are mostly matters of perspective. Either you let the thing bother you or not.

Mental illness is completely different. That's all there is to say.

[Capt Dizle]

Twenty five years ago when I was a young know it all and my sister was suicidal I told her to quit being a whine and just kill herself already. I thought like Kaak. She got help...therapy and medication. She is still around.

After spending months alternately doing nothing, pacing the floor for hours, or sitting in front of my computer posting on internet sites like this one (with a bottle of rum and a loaded .38 beside the keyboard), I decided to get some help. Meds and therapy.

Yesterday I told her how sorry I was for the way I acted. She was very kind. Live and learn.

Of course she told me to stop being a whine and invoke Jesus. "Get thee behind me Satan".

I am just taking it a day at a time now.

[Kaak]

Mental illness is completely different. That's all there is to say.

I agree, and even said so. But few people read before they slander