History and Sexual Orientation

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

The Emancipation Proclamation produced a revolutionary change in the society and economy of United States.

I would argue the 13th or 14th Amendment was much more of a revolutionary change .

But Reconstruction failed in changing racial relations with the 14th Amendment.

Chegitz and you made a good, valid point, but I think my thesis would provide for a more interesting challenge.
It will be a little more work for me to prove that the Emancipation Proclamation truly did create a revolutionary change.

The 13th Amendment finished what the Emancipation Proclamation began, but the EP was the document that provided a springboard, so to speak.


And Timex, be careful, or I might start investigating your sexual orientation.

[Imran Siddiqui]

It will be a little more work for me to prove that the Emancipation Proclamation truly did create a revolutionary change.

Well that's true. The EP basically did nothing, so to say it created a revolutionary change you have to look at indirect results.

[leftover_crack]

Hadrian. argueably one of the greatest roman emperors was as gay as they get. He had a boy that went around with him and he never had any children. When the boy fell off a boat and died Hadrian was so devasted he built a huge Bath house in England in his honor

[MrFun]

The fact that Abraham Lincoln was reelected after having issue the Emancipation Proclamation, shows that many Americans have begun to reconsider their views on race, as well as slavery.

I need to do more research -- I might end up creating a better thesis.

[Imran Siddiqui]

The fact that Abraham Lincoln was reelected after having issue the Emancipation Proclamation, shows that many Americans have begun to reconsider their views on race, as well as slavery.

Eh... that's a streach to say. I see no causal relationship between the EP and Lincoln's reelection. Most Northerners wanted slavery abolished by that time anyway.

The fact is if the war was going badly Lincoln would have been kicked out. It was the success of the war in 1863-64 that made Lincoln being reelected. The EP had nothing to do with it.

[des-esseintes]

Hitler.

[leftover_crack]

Hitler was not gay. He had some wierd sexual habits like having young girls piss on him. But there is no proof he was ever homosexual.

Stalin is another matter...there is alot of speculation he may have been gay

[Imran Siddiqui]

But Reconstruction failed in changing racial relations with the 14th Amendment.

The racial relations aren't the most important thing of the 14th Amendment. MUCH more imporant was applying the Constitution (especially the Bill of Rights) to the states. That had an immense influence, especially the due process clause.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by leftover_crack
Stalin is another matter...there is alot of speculation he may have been gay

On the death of his first wife (circa 1921) Stalin remarked, "The only thing human inside me has died." How prophetic he was.

[Giancarlo]

Stalin? Gay? That isn't true. That man was straight and a nutcase.

[Boris Godunov]

Here is a list I found of Historical Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual folks:

Alexander the Great
*Macedonian Ruler, 300 B.C.
Socrates
*Greek Philosopher, 400 B.C.
Sappho
*Greek Woman Poet, 600 B.C.
Hadrian
*Roman Emperor, 1st-2nd c.
Richard the Lionhearted
*English King, 12th c.
Saladin
*Sultan of Egypt and Syria
Desiderius Erasmus
*Dutch Monk, Philosopher
Francis Bacon
*English statesman, author
Frederick the Great
*King of Prussia
Lord Byron
*English poet, 18th c.
Walt Whitman
*U.S. poet, author, 19th c.
Oscar Wilde
*Irish author, 19th c.
Marcel Proust
*French author, 20th c.
Colette
*French author, 20th c.
Gertrude Stein
*U.S. poet, author, 20th c.
Alice B. Toklas
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Federico Garcia Lorca
*Spanish author, 20th c.
Cole Porter
*U.S. composer, 20th c.
Virginia Woolf
*English author, 20th c.
Leonard Bernstein
*U.S. composer, 20th c.
Pope Julius III
*1550-1555
T.E. Lawrence (likely, but uncertain)
*English soldier, author, 20th c.
Jean Cocteau
*French writer, director, 20th c.
Charles Laughton
*English actor, 20th c.
Marguerite Yourcenar
*Belgian author, 20th c.
Tennessee Williams
*U.S. Playwright, 20th c.
James Baldwin
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Andy Warhol
*U.S. artist, 20th c.
Michelangelo (debatable, IMO)
*Italian artist, 15th c.
Leonardo Da Vinci
*Ital. Artist, scientist, 15th c.
Christopher Marlowe
*Eng. Playwright, 16th c.
Herman Melville
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Horatio Alger, Jr.
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Tchaikovsky
*Russian composer, 19th c.
Willa Cather
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Amy Lowell
*U.S. author, 19th & 20th c.
E.M. Forster
*English author, 20th c.
John M. Keynes
*English economist, 20th c.
Ludwig Wittgenstein
*Australian mathematician, 20th c.
Bessie Smith
*U.S. singer, 20th c.
Noel Coward
*English playwright, 20th c.
Christopher Isherwood
*English author, 20th c.
Pier Paolo Pasolini
*Italian film director, 20th c.
Yukio Mishima
*Japanese author, 20th c.
Eleanor Roosevelt
*U.S. stateswoman, 20th c.
Julius Caesar
*Roman Emperor, 100-44 B.C.
Augustus Caesar (never heard this before)
*Roman Emperor
Harvey Milk
*U.S. politician, 20th c.
Bayard Rustin
*U.S. Civil Rights activist, 20th c.
James I
*English King, 16th-17th c.
Queen Anne (New to me as well)
*English Queen, 18th c.
Marie Antoinette (huh???)
*French Empress, 18th c.
Melissa Etheridge
*U.S. Rock Star, 20th c.
Pope Benedict IX
*1032-1044
Mary Sarton
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Edna Ferber
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Elton John
*English Rock Star, 20th c.
Margaret Fuller
*U.S. writer, educator, 20th c.
Montezuma II (wha????)
*Aztec ruler, 16th c.
Peter the Great (news to me as well)
*Russian Czar, 17th-18th c.
Langston Hughes
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Pope John XII
*955-964
Madame de Stael
*French writer, 17th-18th c.
Martina Navratilova
*U.S. tennis star, 20th c.
Greg Louganis
*U.S. Olympic swimmer, 20th c.
Billie Jean King
*U.S. tennis star, 20th c.
Roberta Achtenburg
*U.S. politician, 20th c.
Barney Frank
*U.S. Congressman, 20th c.
Gerry Studds
*U.S. Congressman, 20th c.
Hans Christian Andersen
*Danish author, 19th c.
Tom Dooley
*U.S. M.D. missionary, 20th c.
J. Edgar Hoover
*U.S. director of the FBI., 20th c.
Frida Kahlo
*Mexican artist, 20th c.
Suleiman the Magnificent
*Ottoman ruler, 15th c.
Rock Hudson
*U.S. actor, 20th c.
Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz
*Mexican author, 16th c.
Ralph Waldo Emerson
*U.S. author, 19th c.
Candace Gingrich
*Gay Rights activist, 20th c.
Margarethe Cammermeyer
*U.S. Army Colonel, 20th c.
Zoe Dunning
*U.S. Military Reservist, 20th c.
Tom Waddel
*U.S. M.D., Olympic star, 20th c.
Kate Millet
*U.S. author, 20th c.
Janis Joplin
*U.S. singer, 20th c.
Rudolf Nuryev
*Russian dancer, 20th c.
Waslaw Nijinsky
*Russian dancer, 20th c.
Ernst Röhm
*German Nazi leader, 20th c.
Dag Hammerskjold
*Swedish UN Secretary, 209th c.
Aristotle
*Greek philosopher, 384-322 B.C.
Paula Gunn Allen
*Native American author, 20th c.
Angela Davis
*U.S. political activist, 20th c.
June Jordan
*U.S. author, activist, 20th c.
Rainer Maria Rilke
*German poet, 20th c.
James Dean
*U.S. actor, 20th c.
Montgomery Clift
*U.S. actor, 20th c.
Baron VonSteuben
*German General, Valley Forge
Edward II
*English King, 14th c.

The list seems to have forgotten Voltaire, who was likely Frederick The Great's lover for a period of time. It also omits Elagabalus, Rome's most decadent emperor. It also omits a slew of gay composers, including Camille Saint-Saens, Samuel Barber, Giancarlo Menotti, Franz Schubert, etc.

And considering the inclusion of Michaelangelo, I'd think they'd at least include the possibilities of Newton and Buchanan.

[Jon Miller]

umm, I remember hearing that FDR's wife was a lesbian (or at least engaged in homosexual sex)

Jon Miller

[Boris Godunov]

Eleanor Roosevelt was certainly a lesbian...hmmm, how could they omit her???

[Jon Miller]

you forgot

pretty much all greeks for a period of time

Jon Miller

[Heresson]

Suleiman the Magnificent wasn't gay.
Perhaps he was bi; Mehmet the Conqueror (the
one that captured Cople) liked boys as well as half or all Egyptian and Turkish sultans... But Suleiman loved his only wife, a Polish girl in fact, for sure.