Your political views

[Sava]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
I love communists, they remind me of various fundamentalists. Thier faith is the common denomenator.

Anyone who believes in the Judeo-Christian and Islamic God, IMO, is a fundamentalist. (Atheists are also wrong)

The difference between US (the ones you brand as commies) and YOU (every theist) is that we put our faith in humanity's ability to create a utopian society, not in some invisible mythical, fabled god.

[Jon Miller]

but to be a theist and a communist, that is the best

Jon Miller

[Sava]

I'm following in your footsteps Che ... although I would never proclaim myself a communist ... even if I agree with some of Chomsky, Trotsky, or Lenin... like it or not, communism is exactly what the SU was and China is.

[loinburger]

If you think Anarachy is just mess, go read some Bakounine, some Proudhon, some Baboeuf, or just log off.

If you really think that anarchy==transcendence, then read some Hobbes.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Sava
we put our faith in humanity's ability to create a utopian society, not in some invisible mythical, fabled god.

You put your faith in a system that has failed each and everytime it was put to practical use.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Albert Speer
Sava:

The problem is that the government has almost always been proven inefficient at controlling those things you mentioned. It turns into a swollen bureaucracy,

A swollen bureaucracy that somehow manages to have lower overhead, less waste, and costs less to consumers than for profit corporations. Yes, you have to deal with bureacratic headaches from time to time, depending on whether the government considers the department worth the resources (say child and welfare services, which gets shafted). As you haven't worked for a real corporation yet, you have no idea what a bloated bureaucracy is like. Trust me, the government is far from bloated. Understaffed and overworked is more like it.

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Sava
Anyone who believes in the Judeo-Christian and Islamic God, IMO, is a fundamentalist. (Atheists are also wrong)

So if you believe in God you're wrong, and if you don't believe in God you're wrong? That covers everybody, so at least I know I'm not in the boat alone...

[Sava]

Che... corporations are swollen bureaucracies... with the government, the people have the power (in theory) to force change. Ideally, everyone in the government answers to society as a whole. The problem is that there is no accountability to the people.

[Sava]

Originally posted by loinburger


So if you believe in God you're wrong, and if you don't believe in God you're wrong? That covers everybody, so at least I know I'm not in the boat alone...

If you believe in God, you might be right but you have no proof or info to base your belief on. You should believe in your own ignorance and proclaim that you don't know. Even if one of the religions was the one true religion, it would be wrong to believe in them without proof or truth to base your belief on.

EDIT: Atheism is the belief that absolutely nothing exists. Theism is the belief that something exists. Being an agnostic is the way to go.

Socrates said something to the effect of, "The man who claims to know but really doesn't is not as wise as the man who admits he doesn't know."

[alofatti]

Originally posted by Sava
"we put our faith in humanity's ability to create a utopian society, not in some invisible mythical, fabled god."

reply from DinoDoc
"You put your faith in a system that has failed each and everytime it was put to practical use. "

Can you tell me that this system has succeeded??

[Sava]

my system hasn't been tried yet.... in fact, it's a revision of American Democracy and Capitalism...

DD, I'll make it official... I AM NOT A COMMIE

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Sava
DD, I'll make it official... I AM NOT A COMMIE

Then the statement of mine you originally responded to wasn't refering to you, was it?

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Sava
EDIT: Atheism is the belief that absolutely nothing exists.

That's nihilism. Atheists don't believe in a god or gods, which covers those who disbelieve and those who have no belief either way.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Sava
I'm following in your footsteps Che ... although I would never proclaim myself a communist ... even if I agree with some of Chomsky, Trotsky, or Lenin... like it or not, communism is exactly what the SU was and China is.

I was not a communist until I went to DePaul. Take Rose Spaulding's Politics of Latin America class. That's what did me in (although she's move to the right since I took the class in 1989). When you learn that the US happily broke its own laws as well as the laws of other countries to get what it wanted, you suddenly reaslize that there is no logical reason to suddenly respect the law on this side of the border.

I went from socialist to defeated in one class. There is simply no way to reform the system. The repressive apartus won't allow it. They'd overthrow any serious socialist effort that somehow managed to get elected. That really took the wind out of my sails.

Then this commies said something that messed with my head, he mentioned that communism worked once, in the Paris Commune. Oh, I shoulda known to keep walking. Everyone tells you those sneaky bastards will say anything, but I was vulnerable, having just had all my political ideals smashed. The rest, we shall say, is history.

[Sava]

Che: I might agree with the idea that there is simply no way to reform the system. But communism is just not the way to go. I guess my image of communism is different from yours because my family escaped communism and came to America in 1958.

DD: I thought you were referring to me.

loinburger: but part of the pillar of atheism is that they are absolutely sure that there is no god or gods, I don't know if that is right or wrong... Theists are wrong because they can't prove their god(s) existence, Atheists are wrong because they can't disprove the theists god(s) existence.