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U.S. must take preemptive action, Bush says

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  • #46
    Originally posted by ZoboZeWarrior
    The fact that "french" (our gouvernment, I presume) have both interest that peace remaind in the region and doubts about the real threat of Iracq.
    I really was mentioning Iraq. I was refering to French actions dating back to the US raid on Libya.
    I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
    For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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    • #47
      No...the more I think about this, the more I'm troubled by it. This is more of the same interventionist crap that got us IN the current situation to start with.

      We can't win that way.

      with pre-emptive strikes!

      -=Vel=-
      The list of published books grows. If you're curious to see what sort of stories I weave out, head to Amazon.com and do an author search for "Christopher Hartpence." Help support Candle'Bre, a game created by gamers FOR gamers. All proceeds from my published works go directly to the project.

      Comment

      • #48
        Perfect example of the "pre-emptive strike" idea gone really, really wrong.

        No Problem With New FBI Surveillance Guidelines, Scholar Says

        WASHINGTON--The Justice Department is expected to announce today new guidelines giving greater latitude to FBI agents to monitor Internet sites, libraries, and religious institutions without first having to offer evidence of potential criminal activity. Roger Pilon, vice president for legal affairs at the Cato Institute and a former Justice Department official, had the following remarks:

        "As reported in the press, the new FBI surveillance guidelines present no serious problems. Especially under post-September 11 circumstances, law enforcement monitoring of public places is simply good, pro-active police work that violates the rights of no one. The same is true for topical research not directly related to a specific crime, which the new guidelines will permit.

        "Depending on how the work is conducted, there is always the potential for abuse, of course. But unless the new latitude leads to significant abuse, that potential should not preclude officials from taking an active role not simply in prosecuting but in preventing crime as well."

        ******

        -=Vel=-
        The list of published books grows. If you're curious to see what sort of stories I weave out, head to Amazon.com and do an author search for "Christopher Hartpence." Help support Candle'Bre, a game created by gamers FOR gamers. All proceeds from my published works go directly to the project.

        Comment

        • #49
          Cato is a Libertarian think tank, Vel. They would be the first to complain if they thought that its went over the line.
          I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
          For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

          Comment

          • #50
            Which means . . . THEY'VE SOLD OUT!!!!!
            Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

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            • #51
              Apparently, somebody forgot to tell it to the guy who made the comments....

              I'm just not sure I'm convinced that granting the FBI the right to snoop in on the Luthern Ladies' Bake Sale is going to help catch bad guys....

              The potential for abuse here is HUGE! No...it's so far beyond huge that it defies description.

              This is an open license for the FBI (who, by the way, is being strictly forbidden to even look in the general direction of events surrounding 9/11) to snoop on anyone at any time without having to show probable cause???

              No way.



              -=Vel=-
              The list of published books grows. If you're curious to see what sort of stories I weave out, head to Amazon.com and do an author search for "Christopher Hartpence." Help support Candle'Bre, a game created by gamers FOR gamers. All proceeds from my published works go directly to the project.

              Comment

              • #52
                Originally posted by chegitz guevara
                Which means . . . THEY'VE SOLD OUT!!!!!
                To what? Would you like me to dig up articles post-Sept 11 that are critical of the government? I can find them easily enough.
                I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

                Comment

                • #53
                  It wasn't that the rules weren't in place for the FBI to find the bad guys, it's that they were too busy looking for drugs to look for bad guys. And because they were ordered by the Pres to stop investigating the people giving money to the bad guys. In none of the cases of FBI f***-ups was it because of rules, but because of bureaucracy and politics.

                  All the new rules do is make it easier to spy on internal dissent.
                  Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                  Comment

                  • #54
                    Originally posted by DinoDoc
                    To what? Would you like me to dig up articles post-Sept 11 that are critical of the government? I can find them easily enough.
                    Come on, let me be a smart ass once in a while.
                    Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                    Comment

                    • #55
                      Vel, the United States and Saudi Arabia have been de facto allies since the 1930s when United States geologists discovered oil in Saudi Arabia. In exchange for oil rights, we backed the Saud family's conquest of the peninsula.

                      When Saddam attacked Kuwait, Saudi Arabia felt threatened and asked us for help. That's why we "intervened."
                      Last edited by Ned; June 5, 2002, 15:19.
                      http://tools.wikimedia.de/~gmaxwell/jorbis/JOrbisPlayer.php?path=John+Williams+The+Imperial+M arch+from+The+Empire+Strikes+Back.ogg&wiki=en

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                      • #56
                        ***Quote from the article I posted earlier - emphasis added by me***

                        giving greater latitude to FBI agents to monitor Internet sites, libraries, and religious institutions without first having to offer evidence of potential criminal activity.

                        Yeah...it makes it easier all right....it's also about half a step away from ditching the entire CONCEPT of due process....and why not?! Imagine how much more efficient it'd be!



                        That sucks....no two ways about it.

                        -=Vel=-
                        The list of published books grows. If you're curious to see what sort of stories I weave out, head to Amazon.com and do an author search for "Christopher Hartpence." Help support Candle'Bre, a game created by gamers FOR gamers. All proceeds from my published works go directly to the project.

                        Comment

                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Velociryx
                          giving greater latitude to FBI agents to monitor Internet sites, libraries, and religious institutions without first having to offer evidence of potential criminal activity.
                          I just thought that I would mention something that wasn't made clear in your article Vel.

                          The new guidelines say that FBI agents now have the authority to enter public places and forums (ie internet sites, libraries, etc.) to observe, develop leads and investigate. Religious institutions aren't even mentioned in the change.
                          I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                          For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

                          Comment

                          • #58
                            Originally posted by chegitz guevara
                            So, we're gonna keep Iran out while letting Turkey occupy Northern Iraq? Seems two-faced.

                            Who said turkey would occupy nothern iraq? What the hell do you base this on? If anything? I love how some of you people jump to such conclusions.

                            As for Iran. It is still the policy of washington to contain Shiite fundamentalism, which could destabilize the entire region. So it does not threaten our energy interests.

                            If we go into Iraq, we're gonna have to stay in Iraq to keep it together as a territorial entity. Otherwise it breaks up into a Kurdistan, a poor Sunni Arab republic around Bagdad, and a Southern oil-rich Shi'ite state.
                            No it doesnt. Afghanistan hasnt. The ethnic divide is even larger than that of Iraq. Stop getting hysterical and looking at the huge ask ahead. We will cross those bridges when we get to them.

                            It's time to stop this madman at our helm. One can only hope that it will be proven that the Administration knew and did nothing. . . . of course, that might prompt them to proclaim the Republic of Gilead
                            There is no madman out our helm.Your just looking to bash a president who still is riding high 70% approval ratings. And honestly, I think your kind are getting scared that the country actually likes him, your cheap pot-shots arent working to crack him. His handling of the economy and WoT has been good.



                            Zobo: A cassius bell already exists. He tried to assanite Bush Sn. and he is a meglomaniac dictator who is obessed with WoMD. Are you people blind to see that if Terrorists got ahold of these, millions would die. I dont wanna take that chance, Im glad bush and the majority of Americans holds the same view.


                            As for the cheap accusations that bush is controlled by corporations. Typical BS drivel when theres nothing Intellegent to say about the topic.

                            Comment

                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Velociryx
                              ***Quote from the article I posted earlier - emphasis added by me***

                              giving greater latitude to FBI agents to monitor Internet sites, libraries, and religious institutions without first having to offer evidence of potential criminal activity.

                              Yeah...it makes it easier all right....it's also about half a step away from ditching the entire CONCEPT of due process....and why not?! Imagine how much more efficient it'd be!



                              That sucks....no two ways about it.

                              -=Vel=-
                              I'm sorry Vel, but the Internet is the largely in the public domain. There is no expectation of privacy in public fora. I am amazed that the FBI could not look at terrorist's websites until now. What a joke!
                              Last edited by Ned; June 5, 2002, 15:52.
                              http://tools.wikimedia.de/~gmaxwell/jorbis/JOrbisPlayer.php?path=John+Williams+The+Imperial+M arch+from+The+Empire+Strikes+Back.ogg&wiki=en

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                              • #60
                                Ya they cant even go into public chatroom and moniter activity! Until now atleast

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