Which Civilization has been the biggest bunch of bastards throughout history?

[Jon Miller]

everyone were complete bastards before 1950 or so

and Islam is definitely in the running

but western europe is also as are many other groups

Islam is a very large culture and has had both positive and negative groups

as had many other cultures

I personally think the two (western and islam) were pretty even for those years (6-17)

but recently (19.5+) west has been better

remember Chris that you have to include a lot of russia and germany and the like in the west culture group

comparing Islam to England is not fair

Jon Miller

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
I say China, just because of the question, throughout history. The Chinese have been around twice as long s any other civilization, thus they've had twice the time to be bastards.

After that, it would be impossible to single any group out for exceptional bastardhod among their peers. The Germans, the Slavs, the Aryans, the Bantu, the Arabs, the Mongols, all have great rivers of blood in their history.

ayh, I think I agree with you

bascially prior to 19th everyone were bastards and China has been arround the longest so ....

Jon Miller

[Ramo]

The Mongols.

Given their numbers and the time, Mongolian atrocities had been unmatched. Combine atrocities by Turko-Mongols (Timur the Lame et al.), and you rack up an even higher body count.

Of course, this is due to incredibly superior technology, more than anything else.

[chequita guevara]

Chris, singling out Islam and pretending it is somehow exceptional in history is rather ludicrous. The Germanic nations of the post-Roman era were every bit as expansionist and bloody, and they were a heck of a lot more intellerant to boot.

It isn't that what you say about the bloody crecent isn't true. It's that you write as though it is the worst. I'm not sure that worst can truely be quantitified historically.



Or are you just being an American-Boddington?

[DinoDoc]

A view of Islamic conquest not white-washed through muslim sources:
http://www.secularislam.org/jihad/

It might help your case just a bit if you chose sources that were not self-proclaimed anti-islamic.

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Chris, singling out Islam and pretending it is somehow exceptional in history is rather ludicrous. The Germanic nations of the post-Roman era were every bit as expansionist and bloody, and they were a heck of a lot more intellerant to boot.

It isn't that what you say about the bloody crecent isn't true. It's that you write as though it is the worst. I'm not sure that worst can truely be quantitified historically.



Or are you just being an American-Boddington?

che. I think the main reason he picked Islam is that many here seem to want to ignore it's past and current direction and white wash it. There were many desperately trying to prove that Islam was an enlightented civ that only responded when attacked. That only made him more determined to show them the opposite. They kept listing postive attributes when the thread clearly stated who has been consistently a bastard throughout history. Was Islam any worse than the Chinese or Europeans? I can't answer that because there is no way to go back and compare every single event on both sides. Chris's attack on Islam should have made people actually think about it, but instead they called him a biggot and tried to shift all that they did on the Europeans. I guess its hard for them to admit what they did in the past since they are still behind them in what they do in the current world. The only way a civ is ever going to move on is if they can look back at their history and see the horrible things that they did and not only the horrible things done to them. The Arabs have not been able to do that as far as I can tell. Because of that they will always be in a victim mode and all too willing to justify things like jihad and war. Has the West been able to do this? In most cases yes. But we still have a long way to go to.

As for the actual question of the thread. It's France hands down. They are bastards even when they aren't strong enough to do anyting really bad.

[Imran Siddiqui]

I have no idea why many people here want to bend over and give islam a big kiss on the backside, but I never will.
For all their fine accomplishments they left a blood trail miles wide with a history of aggression and intolernce they extends to this day.

*cough* Christianity.

It if funny that you call Islam the biggest bastards in history when Christianity has done the same things, sometimes worse. Your Christianity bias is showing through.

It seems in vogue today to blame Europe and America for the world's problems, and theiren lies Islam's number one problem, and inability to look truthfully at it's past and what it wants, and to blame it's problems on others.

Your the perfect example Imran, and educated man, yet you turn your back on knowledge and fall into retoric and falsehood when anything that shows a bad light on Islam is brought up.

Ironically you portray me as a anti-European and anti-American here . It is so funny, I probably don't have to respond.

You are the perfect example of what is symptamatic of Islam, blame others for your own short comings, and turn nelson's blind eye to the truth of history

You mean like the same in the Christian world, who are responsible for the greatest horrors in the world. After all the Christian world owned about 90% of the world at one time and destroyed, killed, and plundered in the name of colony.

Transcend is just a fool, so we need not concern ourselves with him, but you should know better.

He is obviously more intelligent (especially on history) than you seem to be.

Yet you thought differently before I dared question Islam.

Actually I didn't (check out the forum on the CBS league website), I just didn't want to say it in front of you. But since you've revealed yourself to be a bigot and a collosol moron, I don't care anymore.

Chris, singling out Islam and pretending it is somehow exceptional in history is rather ludicrous. The Germanic nations of the post-Roman era were every bit as expansionist and bloody, and they were a heck of a lot more intellerant to boot.

It isn't that what you say about the bloody crecent isn't true. It's that you write as though it is the worst. I'm not sure that worst can truely be quantitified historically.

EXACTLY! Islamic conquest was in no way worse than European wars of conquest (um... Crusades anyone? What about the 30 Years War?).

Or are you just being an American-Boddington?

Only problem is that he believes his ignorant babblings. A trip to my ignore list is forseeable in the near future.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Spray, his first post:

Islam is the answer.

For almost 1400 years they have been constant aggressors and bald faced conqerors, and to this day can't get along with anyone who isn't Muslim.

No other culture spends more time and effort on racial hatred and training then Islamic states.

A history of misery, oppression and conquest.

Does this seem he believes they did anything good? He also seems to throw away anything good they did. Historials agree on their good points, but Chris doesn't.

That shows him to a bigot.

In a bastard test, you have to also look at the good, because the difference between good and bad makes a bastard. That is why I picked the Mongols. Little good and lots bad.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Only problem is that he believes his ignorant babblings. A trip to my ignore list is forseeable in the near future.

I'm not so sure. I remember his postings in the past being a lot more balanced, but recently he's gone into hyperbole mode.

[Imran Siddiqui]

So you think obvious troll?

I dunno... with the whole WTC thing and Israel he's gone off the deep end.

[Zoid]

I voted for other and thought Israel. But then I changed my mind... Israel has in fact only been bastards for 54 years. England and Spain were bastards for several hundred years. Therefore I would like to change my vote to a tie between England and Spain.

[Zoid]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Spray, his first post:

Islam is the answer.

For almost 1400 years they have been constant aggressors and bald faced conqerors, and to this day can't get along with anyone who isn't Muslim.

No other culture spends more time and effort on racial hatred and training then Islamic states.

A history of misery, oppression and conquest.

Does this seem he believes they did anything good? He also seems to throw away anything good they did. Historials agree on their good points, but Chris doesn't.

That shows him to a bigot.

I´m with you 100% on this Imran. It´s clear that Chris has been convinced by the anti-islam propaganda that has replaced the anti-communist propaganda of the ´50s...

I know he would go through the roof if I or anyone else started shouting that "jews are by nature evil and that they want to control the world" based on Israels actions lately.

[Sprayber]

Ok Imran. Chris is a biggot and you hold all the answers.

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Kamrat X

I know he would go through the roof if I or anyone else started shouting that "jews are by nature evil and that they want to control the world" based on Israels actions lately.

Exactly what do you think happens daily here? Ooops thats just me being fooled by the Jew media I suppose.

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
So you think obvious troll?

I dunno... with the whole WTC thing and Israel he's gone off the deep end.

You support terrotists and deny that the Pals have any responsibity at all for the problems over there. Who has gone off the deep end?