Democrat Suggests Administration Involvement In 9-11 Attack

[The Mad Monk]

I like the way people are saying "memos should have been sent to the President", and "The President should have sent those memos to the right people", as if he were some kind of mail boy...

We have millions of people in government; some of those people collect data, others analyse it, and still others determine the importance of the data and who it should be sent to. This is true for everything from milspysat images to the latest census data to that conversation with an informant in Belfast. There is no way one man can keep track of it all, which is why the others are there.

The president was never intended to be a micromanagement-type position. The last time someone tried was Carter.

Need I say more?

[MosesPresley]

Originally posted by joseph1944
Do you know how many time the Military received a threat. At Mare Island we received hundreds over the years. They did not tell us about evey one, but some we were told to be on the lookout for anyone we did not know asking about the Yard.

Anonymous threats are a little different. OBL is known to have been involved in the original WTC bombing, the embassy bombing in Africa, and the bombing of the USS Cole. A threat involving him has to be taken a little more seriously than an anonymous crank. The man had a track record of hitting US targets. This isn't 20/20 hindsight. The Bush administration has admitted they thought it would be a "traditional" hi-jacking. I find it funny and revolting that because it would be a traditional hi-jacking, it was OK to do nothing. I mean, what's up with that kind of thinking. It just goes to show you, that they don't give a tinker's damn about the regular people.

----------------------------------------

I was stationed in Mare Island in '81 for my C school, cryptography. When were you there?

[MosesPresley]

Originally posted by The Mad Monk
I like the way people are saying "memos should have been sent to the President", and "The President should have sent those memos to the right people", as if he were some kind of mail boy...

We have millions of people in government; some of those people collect data, others analyse it, and still others determine the importance of the data and who it should be sent to. This is true for everything from milspysat images to the latest census data to that conversation with an informant in Belfast. There is no way one man can keep track of it all, which is why the others are there.

The president was never intended to be a micromanagement-type position. The last time someone tried was Carter.

Need I say more?

It has been released by the Bush administration itself, that W himself saw at least one memo and was personally advised on the OBL threat. They also said they didn't want to get bogged down with OBL like the Clinton administration.

[TCO]

Originally posted by MosesPresley


Anonymous threats are a little different. OBL is known to have been involved in the original WTC bombing, the embassy bombing in Africa, and the bombing of the USS Cole. A threat involving him has to be taken a little more seriously than an anonymous crank. The man had a track record of hitting US targets. This isn't 20/20 hindsight. The Bush

It's monday morning quarterbacking. If he coulda stopped that threat fomr happeneing, he would have. What are you trying to imply. Obvioulsy they took it less seriously than they should hagve. But they get warnings all the time. What are you trying to imply? Like McKiney?

[MosesPresley]

Originally posted by GP


It's monday morning quarterbacking. If he coulda stopped that threat fomr happeneing, he would have. What are you trying to imply. Obvioulsy they took it less seriously than they should hagve. But they get warnings all the time. What are you trying to imply? Like McKiney?

I won't take the bait,

It's obvious they could have done more. They did, after all, have the names of the muslims in the civil aviation schools. They knew who the people were. I'm not going to go all McKinney on you, but it was certainly interesting that they had the names of hijackers right after the attack. It was a simple matter of survelliance. It would have been easy to track these suspicious people and prevent them from any sort of terrorist activity.

The Bush administration was either grossly imcompetent or insanely arrogant. Either way we paid through the nose for this mistake.

[TCO]

bull****.

It's monday morning quarterbacking...

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by MosesPresley
The Bush administration was either grossly imcompetent or insanely arrogant. Either way we paid through the nose for this mistake.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, isn't it?

[MosesPresley]

It's not hindsight or Monday morning quarterbacking. It's called using your intelligence assets judiciously and wisely.

[The Mad Monk]

Check out this article:

http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/09/18/inv.hijacking.philippines/index.html

U.S. warned in 1995 of plot to hijack planes, attack buildings


By Maria Ressa
CNN Correspondent

MANILA, Philippines (CNN) -- The FBI was warned six years ago of a terrorist plot to hijack commercial planes and slam them into the Pentagon, the CIA headquarters and other buildings, Philippine investigators told CNN.

Philippine authorities learned of the plot after a small fire in a Manila apartment, which turned out to be the hideout of Ramzi Yousef, who was later convicted for his role in the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center. Yousef escaped at the time, but agents caught his right-hand man, Abdul Hakim Murad, who told them a chilling tale.

"Murad narrated to us about a plan by the Ramzi cell in the continental U.S. to hijack a commercial plane and ram it into the CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia, and also the Pentagon," said Rodolfo Mendoza, a Philippine intelligence investigator.

Philippine investigators also found evidence targeting commercial towers in San Francisco, Chicago and New York City.

They said they passed that information on to the FBI in 1995, but it's not clear what was done with it.

One week ago, two hijacked commercial jets slammed into the World Trade Center, collapsing the towers. Another jet hit the Pentagon and a fourth crashed in rural Pennsylvania. Authorities believe that fourth jet may have been headed for the Capitol or the White House. Thousands were killed in the attacks.

On Monday, FBI Director Robert Mueller insisted the agency had "no warning signs" of last week's attacks.

Yousef and Murad both have ties to Osama bin Laden, the man President Bush has labeled the "prime suspect" in Tuesday's attacks.

Authorities also found on a computer in the Manila apartment details of a separate plot to bomb 11 U.S. airliners on overseas flights.

Yousef once listed his occupation as "international terrorist" on an ID card, and he has long been considered a disciple of bin Laden.

Murad was a pilot who admitted he had been trained in Afghanistan as well as the United States. Bin Laden, a Saudi native, lives in Afghanistan.

"(Murad) was principally recruited by Yousef's group and bin Laden's group to undertake a suicide mission," said Avelino Razon, superintendent for the Philippine National Police.

Yousef was eventually caught in Pakistan and brought to New York for trial. He was sentenced to life in prison. Murad is also serving a life sentence.

Not only have these threats been made before, but made several different times; what sort of attention should have been paid to these?

Thanks to Drudge for the link.

[Panag]

Originally posted by The Mad Monk
I like the way people are saying "memos should have been sent to the President", and "The President should have sent those memos to the right people", as if he were some kind of mail boy...

We have millions of people in government; some of those people collect data, others analyse it, and still others determine the importance of the data and who it should be sent to. This is true for everything from milspysat images to the latest census data to that conversation with an informant in Belfast. There is no way one man can keep track of it all, which is why the others are there.

The president was never intended to be a micromanagement-type position. The last time someone tried was Carter.

Need I say more?

hi ,

what about , NRO , DIA , NSA , CIA , army , navy and airforce intel , .........they must have seen something , if they did put the pieces together is an other Q , but still the flags should have gone up , ............someone , somewhere in the Us government and in other countries must have known what whas about to happen , .............

one man can keep track of not all , but look at the federation of american science , the warned about an attack as early as 12/2000 , ...........this was one man who sad 40 hours a week behind a comp , and he warned them , ....they did put him in the hospital , .....because they (the government) thought that he was a bit a "fruitcake" , ..............

have a nice day

[TCO]

We've had intel for over 6 years. Hell we probably have threat intel stretching back all the way to WW2. If we acted on every threat assessment, we'd be long done. None of this intel sounds like hardcore, "Mr.X is planning to do Y on day Z."

Obviously, if the powers that be had enough confidence in the intel, they would have acted to prevent the tragedy. Mckinney is an idiot for suggesting that Bush let this happen willingly.

Hindsight is sure nice. But I still remember the day when these attacks happened. Everybody I knew was completely surprised by this. They came out of the blue. It's always easy after a tragedy to critique things...

[SpencerH]

Predicting this kind of specific operation by sigint and other technical int is very very difficult. You need guys (that you deem reliable) on the ground. With the virtual dismantling of those resources by a "politically correct" federal goverment it was extremely unlikely that anyone could have provided a warning that was credible.

[Panag]

Originally posted by SpencerH
Predicting this kind of specific operation by sigint and other technical int is very very difficult. You need guys (that you deem reliable) on the ground. With the virtual dismantling of those resources by a "politically correct" federal goverment it was extremely unlikely that anyone could have provided a warning that was credible.

hi ,

but you know as well as others that there are people who put the pieces and bits together after humanint and other forms of intel , ...

and if right you now the sbs and their other famous counterparts , they had the info , but put it in storage , ....to collect dust , ........

have a nice day

[SpencerH]

Whether someone "knew" is unknowable by those outside of the loop. There is only speculation. In my experience, humanint is only handled at the very highest levels, and those high ranking individuals are not necessarily the best at assessing the intel value or importance of that info.

So if you're suggesting that someone knew - probably, but they didnt have the clout to make it stick.

If you're suggesting other (foreign but friendly) agencies knew but didnt tell - I doubt it.

If your suggesting that other agencies knew and told but were ignored - unfortunately it happens.

[MosesPresley]

Why does everyone keep saying this is hindsight. The Bush administration has already said they knew OBL was planning a hijacking. They have already admitted they knew. They just sat on their hands because it was assumed to be a traditional hijacking, nice euphemism.