Europe Heard From

[ZoboZeWarrior]

I just would be sure that everybody didn't have any doubt !

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Roland
There was a mass rally in Paris.

Really? When was this? I guess your point about the US media is well-founded after all.

What do you mean by "actions"?

Something similar to the proposed trade sanctions by the EU parliment and the massive criticism that Isael has recieved from the French, as an example.

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Something similar to the proposed trade sanctions by the EU parliment and the massive criticism that Isael has recieved from the French, as an example.

you want us to implement trade sanctions against israel now?

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by paiktis22
you want us to implement trade sanctions against israel now?

I posted a news article on the first page (I think), that you may find useful in answering that question on your own and without irritating me further.

[Bereta_Eder]

don't think be sure

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by paiktis22
don't think be sure

I just checked. It is on the first page of this thread.

[Bereta_Eder]

declarative resolution by the europarliement.
in other words nothing - just decorative for now

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by paiktis22
declarative resolution by the europarliement.

Which is what I said.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by BeBro


To be honest, also my respect for the Palestinians is gone to the biggest part after the wave of terracts, esp. during the last time, so I can understand Israels reaction absolutely. However, I don´t believe only military actions alone will end the terror...

bebro : if you mean that ultimately a political solution is necessary, I think you are absolutely right. But it is very difficult for Israel to make the concessions that are required for peace while undergoing this level of terrorist activity. It is in fact very difficult for them to get to a more pragmatic govt (as to long term peace negotiations) when this level of terrorist activity is going on. There must FIRST be a ceasefire, an end to the murder of women and children, before serious negotiations can begin. And Arafat, who has been shown to be an active supporter, inciter, and financier of terrorism must be held to a high standard in using whatever resources remain at his disposal to crack down on terrorism.

I note that the press reports indicate that the Euro Parliament proposal to sanction Israel is unlikely to be implemented, due to the opposition of Britain, the Netherlands, Denmark, and Germany. I note that SOME European nations do seem to have learned something from European history. It is unfortunate that others have not.

I also note that the resolution passed by only 260 to 200 (or so). Does anyone know where I might find breakdowns by nationality and political grouping? (I tried the Euro parl website, but found it a tad difficult to navigate)

LOTM

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by lord of the mark

I also note that the resolution passed by only 260 to 200 (or so). Does anyone know where I might find breakdowns by nationality and political grouping? (I tried the Euro parl website, but found it a tad difficult to navigate)

LOTM

Germans, dutch, danish are traditionally the most "friendly" to Israel so they might have voted against.

in any case for anything EUropean

https://www.europa.eu.int

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Roland
"Moral condemnation by the west is of small value against the Israelis, and of no value against the Palestinians."

About zero value with both, I'd say. Sharon and Arafat have been strengthened dramatically with this escalation.

Read the Israeli press. Moral condemnation by the United States is a matter of great concern across the political spectrum. Moral condemnation by Western Europe is of zero value, as almost all Israelis (including most Labour supporters) consider western europe thoroughly biased against them.

LOTM

[Bereta_Eder]

snip snip

[lord of the mark]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Europe Heard From

Originally posted by Ecowiz Returns


Have those documents been presented to another, imparcial, entity other than the very same Government that started the attacks prior to have knowledge of these documents?

The documents have been presented to the United States.

But would it matter? Suppose those documents proved true? Would you or your govt disown arrafat? Or would you repeat that the palestinian terror is merely a result of "occupation", and so is no ground for turning from Arafat? until European govts make clear that this evidence would impact policy, why should it be shared with them?


LOTM

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by paiktis22
there you go:

Middle East - call for arms embargo and suspension of association agreement
Motions for resolutions on the situation in the Middle East
Doc.: B5-0194/2002, B5-0195/2002, B5-0196/2002, B5-0197/2002, B5-0198/2002, B5-0199/2002
Debate: 09.04.2002
Vote: 10.04.2002
Vote

Against the background of the escalating Middle East conflict, MEPs voted 269 to 208 with 22 abstentions in favour of a resolution urging full and immediate implementation of UN Security Council Resolutions 1397, 1402 and 1403, which call for the withdrawal of the Israeli army from the Palestinian territories, including Ramallah.

The resolution call on the Council to institute an arms embargo on Israel and Palestine and on the Commission and Council to suspend the EU-Israel Euro-Mediterranean Association Agreement.

The resolution strongly condemns all indiscriminate terrorist attacks by suicide bombings against Israel and calls on the Palestinian Authority to make greater efforts to prevent acts of terrorism.

At the same time, it condemns the military escalation pursued by the Sharon government, the oppression of the Palestinian civilian population by the Israeli army and the systematic destruction of infrastructures on the West Bank. MEP make clear to the Israeli Government that Yasser Arafat must enjoy freedom of movement.

They deplore the refusal by Prime Minister Sharon to let the EU high-level delegation meet President Arafat. Looking to today's summit in Madrid between the EU, the United States, Russia and the UN, MEPs call for consideration to be given to the sending of an international peacekeeping and monitoring force to the region under UN auspices.

Parliament stresses the special responsibility of the USA in the crisis. It also welcomes the endorsement by the Arab League of the Saudi proposal, which it invites the Israeli Government to recognise as a turning point in the Arab states' attitude towards the conflict.

Lastly the resolution calls on Israel to guarantee the media free access to the occupied territories and to allow EU diplomatic and consular authorities to contact EU citizens in the area.

Prior to the vote EPP-ED leader Hans-Gert POETTERING (EPP-ED, D) said a majority in his group were opposed to the resolution as it stands.
Press enquiries:
Alexandre Stutzmann
(Strasbourg) tel.(33) 3 881 74005
(Brussels) tel.(32-2) 28 43439
e-mail : foreign-press@europarl.eu.int


http://www2.europarl.eu.int/omk/OM-E...AV=X#SECTION18

Thanks, (though I had seen that already)

Other than the EPP-ED (and just who are they, this inquring yank wants to know?) Im still not sure how the vote broke down, (other than assuming that Germans Dutch and Danes were against, French, Belgians, Spanish and Greeks were for, and that Communists, Greens, and Gaulists were for across nationality, that UK Tories against, and UK labour split) Do you guys not have sources for checking how your "representatives" in the EP voted? Or is the EP still of such limited power and relevance that you and your press dont really care? Or is the monitoring of the voting behavior of ones representatives such a "yank" thing?

LOTM

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


Thanks, (though I had seen that already)

Hmm, then I gues you want the official text with all the votes broken down... I'm a bit lazy to look for it now sorry but if the votes are broken down it is there in the first link I gave.

Other than the EPP-ED (and just who are they, this inquring yank wants to know?)

hmm ok check here.

http://wwwdb.europarl.eu.int/ep5/owa/p_meps2.repartition?ipid=0&ilg=EN&iorig=&imsg=

Im still not sure how the vote broke down, (other than assuming that Germans Dutch and Danes were against, French, Belgians, Spanish and Greeks were for, and that Communists, Greens, and Gaulists were for across nationality, that UK Tories against, and UK labour split)

hmm most of the times it doesn't go by country but by affiliation to the party.
for example european socialists will vote for something, european popular party will vote for something else etc.

Do you guys not have sources for checking how your "representatives" in the EP voted? Or is the EP still of such limited power and relevance that you and your press dont really care?

hehe the second for now