US Constitution

[Kropotkin]

There's nothing about people having the right to happiness. It would be communism If people that weren't part of the political and economic elite could be happy!!!

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Kropotkin
It would be communism If people that weren't part of the political and economic elite could be happy!!!

"happy" apprently meaning "equally miserable"...

[Imran Siddiqui]

What country is your avatar, by the way? I can't identify it.

It's Germany before WW1.

[MrFun]

The U.S. Constitution -- that mystical document.

But seriously now, I would like to bring up an interesting historical example of how Southern states systematically violated the Constitution after Reconstruction.

The 15th Amendment states:

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.

Section 2. The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.


The Southern states passed literacy laws, poll taxes, and the grandfather clause law in order to violate the law of the 15th Amendment.
Southern politicians felt that these tactics of denying blacks the right to vote (as well as poor whites), would work as loopholes. And they did work until the 1960's.

[orange]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
I'd be arrested as a terrorist and executed on the say-so of a military tribunal in a closed session. Wonderful country you guys have down there.

Terrorst? For killing Floyd?? That's the kind of thing that makes you worthy of a statue

btw: as Imran said, it's pre-WWI Germany.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Terrorst? For killing Floyd?? That's the kind of thing that makes you worthy of a statue

Especially if you were FBI .

[David Floyd]

No. actually with 2.7 million Americans using a weapon in "DGU" every year ( according to Mr. Kleck ), all we have to do is wait for some fine upstanding citizen to decide that DF's a mugger and then draws down on him. DF will undoubtedly respond in kind, so either he gets shot or he shoots someone, necessitating a little government sponsored "time out".

If I shot someone who drew a gun on me I'd go to jail? Eh? Since when?

[WhiteElephants]

Re: US Constitution

Since we apparently have some people who believe in the Bill of Rights as if it were a holy book, I would like to make one very large point.

The US government is for the *people*.

The Bill of Rights is not a person, therefore it is not the be all and end all for everything to do with the US. We cannot always look to it for guidance, although it does contain extremely useful advice for some things. Ultimately though, this government is shaped by the will of the people. The people elect representatives, and if there is not a worthy representative, it is their own fault for not correcting the situation. I do not believe that the framers were meant to be looked on as dietys either. That was not their intention, and we should not try to justify an interpretation of the Bill of Rights, because "that's what the framers meant".

The US is not a religion, and the Bill of Rights is not a Holy Book.

Blind allegiance to anything is counter intuitive to any progress.

[loinburger]

Re: Re: US Constitution

Originally posted by WhiteElephants
Since we apparently have some people who believe in the Bill of Rights as if it were a holy book, I would like to make one very large point.
...
Blind allegiance to anything is counter intuitive to any progress.

What the heck?

Are you trying to pull a MrFun on us here, WhiteElephants?

[Wraith]

--"The US government is for the *people*."

And, since this didn't get through the first time, the Constitution is the charter, by the people, granting the federal government power.

Understand?

Let me add that if the government can't be bothered to obey its own rules, why will anyone else?
Aside from superior firepower on the government's part, of course. I really don't want to go back to "might makes right".

--"That was not their intention, and we should not try to justify an interpretation of the Bill of Rights, because "that's what the framers meant"."

Actually, yes it was their intention. It's called the doctrine of original intent, IIRC. The Constitution means what it says. If it needs to be changed, it can be amended, as has already happened several times.

There was just this odd notion of the founders that the government should not be able to place itself above the law...

Wraith
Math illiteracy affects 8 out of every 5 people.

[WhiteElephants]

Re: Re: Re: US Constitution

Originally posted by loinburger


What the heck?

Are you trying to pull a MrFun on us here, WhiteElephants?

I was just mimicing the first post thinking MacTBone would be stomping up and down if anyone were to think of the Bill of Rights in the same way as he thinks of the Constitution. Meaning if his arguement doesn't apply to one, then it obviously doesn't apply to the other.

Wraith -- I know. It was satire.

[loinburger]

Re: Re: Re: Re: US Constitution

Originally posted by WhiteElephants
I was just mimicing the first post thinking MacTBone would be stomping up...

Good. I thought you were either pulling a "Hey, I'll bet you people haven't read this post, so here's the same goddamn post all over again!" or a "The ideas in this post are my original ideas, I swear!" Both would be bad habits to get into.

[WhiteElephants]

I've got enough bad habits already.

[Shi Huangdi]

The US consitution is the supreme law of the land. All of the Federal government's power comes from it. All US actions must be in compliance with the constitution or it's illegal. Now, for an argument on whether gun control would be effective it would be wrong to point to the constitution. But in deciding whether gun control would be legal, as in with deciding if any law is legal, it must be in compliance with the Constitution.

The US constitution was written based on the Lockean ideal of democracy. Lockean democracy first and foremost recognizes the rights of the individual come first and that you should not be hurt just because an arbitrary majority of the population says so. We have rights irrespective of what groups of people want, and those rights should be honored.

[MrFun]

Re: Re: Re: US Constitution

Originally posted by loinburger


What the heck?

Are you trying to pull a MrFun on us here, WhiteElephants?

You can stop your trolling, Loinburger since I do not play troll games.

I do not post the same points repeatedly, unless it is clear that people still do not understand what my arguments are.