This Guy Restores Some Of My Optimism

[Goingonit]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune


For quite the same reason they support the regimes in Kuwait and Saudi-Arabia (which are more oppressive than Iran, btw.).

which is...

[Sikander]

The Taliban are from the era after U.S. involvement in Afghanistan. Their (new) weapons came from Pakistan via China for the most part, though a large percentage of their arsenal was captured from the many armed parties in Afghanistan. The only somewhat shameful connection between the U.S. government and the Taliban was very early on (around 1996-97 IIRC) when the U.S. tried to negotiate with the Taliban who de facto controlled most of Afghanistan. Even this was done for practical and humanitarian reasons and never progressed nearly far enough for the U.S. to recognize the Taliban as the government of Afghanistan. As the Taliban made their true nature more known to the U.S. even these types of contacts were limited to arranging aid shipments.

[Goingonit]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune

1 : the condition of being safe from undergoing or causing hurt, injury, or loss
(Webster)

And let's count the number of people whom the US has helped achieve said condition:

-Western Europe
-Women of Afghanistan
-Its population
-People of Kuwait
-To some extent, Eastern Europe by ending the Cold War
-S. Korea
-Helped S. African blacks through sanctions

Infact, just about the only people whom they haven't

Now let's count the people from whom the US took this condition:

-Vietnam
-They've hurt some Iraqis and Cubans through sanctions
-Terrorists

In fact, the US is certainly less of a threat to world safety than your crappy country, what with the xenophobic right wing and all of Austria's past actions...

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Sikander
Their (new) weapons came from Pakistan ...

True. But you forget the fact that the Pakis can´t cough without the US telling them to do so.

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Goingonit
And let's count the number of people whom the US has helped achieve said condition:
...
-Its population...

Does that include the approx. 2000 civilian bombing victims?

-People of Kuwait

Who will be eternally thankful that their oppressive medieval Emir has been given back to them. Sure. When did you say will there be free elections in Kuwait? 2.250?

In fact, the US is certainly less of a threat to world safety than your crappy country, what with the xenophobic right wing and all of Austria's past actions...

Talk about nationalist stereotypes! With people like you, it may be excusable if a few Austrians get xenophobic.

[oedo]

Originally posted by Goingonit
And let's count the number of people whom the US has helped achieve said condition:

-Western Europe
-Women of Afghanistan
-Its population
-People of Kuwait
-To some extent, Eastern Europe by ending the Cold War
-S. Korea
-Helped S. African blacks through sanctions

Infact, just about the only people whom they haven't

Now let's count the people from whom the US took this condition:

-Vietnam
-They've hurt some Iraqis and Cubans through sanctions
-Terrorists

several 100.000 (if not even 1.000.000) innocent civilians were killed by us troops and bombers after ww2. no other country started that many wars during this time. do you really think this is something us-people should be proud of? and actually most of the examples you mentioned are simply ridiculous (and wrong).

western europe: ok, I live in Berlin and I think I can mainly agree to this point. fair enough.

Women of Afghanistan: some of them were killed by US-bombs. the survivors were freed from a terror regime. most probably they now will be handed over to another terror regime. and if this one will be an US-friendly terror regime the US won´t care about the afghan people´s safety at all. it´s always the same.

Its population: see above

People of Kuwait: yeah, the rich people of Kuwait maybe. those who have the cheap oil. you forget to mention the fact that the kuwait goverment surpressed the kuwait people. the gulf war didn´t change anything for their situation. this war had nothing to do with humanity or such. it was all about oil. I´m surprised you don´t know this.

To some extent, Eastern Europe by ending the Cold War: from my knowledge Gorbatchov wasn´t a US-President or did I miss something?

S. Korea: cool! and what about N. Korea? and what do you think about the fact that right in the moment north and south korea coming closer and a reunification is in sight, president (by accident) bush is talking about declaring war to north korea?

Helped S. African blacks through sanctions: actually I don´t think you´re right here. but even if you are, when will they ever help the N. American blacks?

They've hurt some Iraqis (...) through sanctions: yep. and they killed 100.000 Iraqis....through bombs. now define safety.

In fact, the US is certainly less of a threat to world safety than your crappy country, what with the xenophobic right wing and all of Austria's past actions...

no comment needed here

[Goingonit]

Originally posted by oedo
several 100.000 (if not even 1.000.000) innocent civilians were killed by us troops and bombers after ww2. no other country started that many wars during this time. do you really think this is something us-people should be proud of? and actually most of the examples you mentioned are simply ridiculous (and wrong).

So now you're saying you'd rather NOT have the Americans in WWII.

Women of Afghanistan: some of them were killed by US-bombs. the survivors were freed from a terror regime. most probably they now will be handed over to another terror regime. and if this one will be an US-friendly terror regime the US won´t care about the afghan people´s safety at all. it´s always the same.

Um, I'm sorry, but if you were to ask a woman of Afghanistan, I think you'd get a different response.

Its population:

From agression, invasion, and they kept the peace.

People of Kuwait: yeah, the rich people of Kuwait maybe. those who have the cheap oil. you forget to mention the fact that the kuwait goverment surpressed the kuwait people. the gulf war didn´t change anything for their situation. this war had nothing to do with humanity or such. it was all about oil. I´m surprised you don´t know this.

Rather be oppresed by Kuwaiti gov. than by Saddam.

To some extent, Eastern Europe by ending the Cold War: from my knowledge Gorbatchov wasn´t a US-President or did I miss something?

If you're going to go say that the Americans didn't have a hand in ending Communism...

S. Korea: cool! and what about N. Korea? and what do you think about the fact that right in the moment north and south korea coming closer and a reunification is in sight, president (by accident) bush is talking about declaring war to north korea?

If it weren't for the US, North Korea would be called Korea and South Korea would be called purged

Helped S. African blacks through sanctions: actually I don´t think you´re right here. but even if you are, when will they ever help the N. American blacks?

Not helping someone is way differnet from hurting them. I'm not going to argue that slavery wasn't bad, but that iosn't exactly recent history...

They've hurt some Iraqis (...) through sanctions: yep. and they killed 100.000 Iraqis....through bombs. now define safety.

I'm not sure about that number...?

no comment needed here

Au contraire, I do believe there is. How does Austria answer for WW1? That makes it a threat to world peace! Let's accuse them of government conspiracy theories!

[Goingonit]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune
Does that include the approx. 2000 civilian bombing victims?

Please explain.

Who will be eternally thankful that their oppressive medieval Emir has been given back to them. Sure. When did you say will there be free elections in Kuwait? 2.250?

And the people of Iraq? No earlier than 2,251

Talk about nationalist stereotypes! With people like you, it may be excusable if a few Austrians get xenophobic.

But if Austrians aren't responsible for their country's past actions, what makes you think that Americans are?

[Comrade Tribune]

Come on, we are talking about present actions.

I hold no current Americans responsible for their aggression against Spain 100 years ago.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Goingonit
-They've hurt some Iraqis [snip] through sanctions

How have we hurt the Iraqis through sanctions? Especially when the people of northern Iraq who live under the same sactions live so much better than the people living under Sadam's direct rule.

[Goingonit]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune
Come on, we are talking about present actions.

I hold no current Americans responsible for their aggression against Spain 100 years ago.

In terms of present actions, the American gov. is keeping the world safe for their citizens, who voted them in. They are doing so by attacking people who threaten America. It won't cost 62 quintillion dollars 58 cents, or whatever that crackpot said it would cost. It will kill civilians, but not as many as would be killed were they not doing what they are now. Your exaggerated claims of 100,000 dead from bombings are, simply put, exaggerated.

[Goingonit]

Originally posted by DinoDoc


How have we hurt the Iraqis through sanctions? Especially when the people of northern Iraq who live under the same sactions live so much better than the people living under Sadam's direct rule.

C'mon, appease the Eurocoms a little

Actually sanctions are probably not the best way of conducting foreign intervention; they worked in South Africa because South Africa was democratic - but otherwise, it's the people, not the dictators, who suffer.

[Transcend]

Women of Afghanistan: some of them were killed by US-bombs. the survivors were freed from a terror regime. most probably they now will be handed over to another terror regime. and if this one will be an US-friendly terror regime the US won´t care about the afghan people´s safety at all. it´s always the same.

Its population: see above

Now that's BS. We are actively trying to end the terror regimes in Afghanistan. We may not succeed, but we are better than you guys who haven't done anything and still do nitpicking on us.

People of Kuwait: yeah, the rich people of Kuwait maybe. those who have the cheap oil. you forget to mention the fact that the kuwait goverment surpressed the kuwait people. the gulf war didn´t change anything for their situation. this war had nothing to do with humanity or such. it was all about oil. I´m surprised you don´t know this.

Of course we don't want Saddam to become an oil monopoly, do you? To say Kuwaitis are not better off today than under Saddam only undermines your credibility.

To some extent, Eastern Europe by ending the Cold War: from my knowledge Gorbatchov wasn´t a US-President or did I miss something?

Gorby is only half of the puzzle. Without us showing Soviets their limits East Berliners would still be enjoying long queues and Stasi informants.

S. Korea: cool! and what about N. Korea? and what do you think about the fact that right in the moment north and south korea coming closer and a reunification is in sight, president (by accident) bush is talking about declaring war to north korea?

Before you BS about our involvement in Korea, why don't you ask what yin26 thinks. He is a South Korean after all and should be much much better informed than you.

Helped S. African blacks through sanctions: actually I don´t think you´re right here. but even if you are, when will they ever help the N. American blacks?

By denying SA Apartheid regime our recognition, it will be only a matter of time before they cave in. Instead of accusing us of treating blacks badly, why don't you guys stop throwing firebombs into "Asylantenheime"? I would also like to see Asians being able to walk through Dresden without fearing being harassed by Skinheads.

As for our military killing people, we are only doing this kind of dirty work so you Euros can sit back and enjoy some peace.

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Goingonit
In terms of present actions, the American gov. is keeping the world safe for their citizens, who voted them in.

Wonderful argument. Must remember that line for my next war of aggression. 'We are just keeping the world safe for our Military Domination'. Hilarious.

They are doing so by attacking people who threaten America.

How is North Korea going to threaten America? Throw rice cakes?

Your exaggerated claims of 100,000 dead from bombings are, simply put, exaggerated.

You are mixing it up. I claimed you killed 2.000 in Afghanistan. But their lives are worth less than Western lives, of course.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune
How is North Korea going to threaten America? Throw rice cakes?

Through it nuclear weapons research program, its long range missile tests, and its missile exports.