Announcement

**Dr. Nick** · January 23, 2002, 16:32

Originally posted by Eli

Wrong.
If you accept Judaism as your religion you will be considered Jew for all purposes.

Makes sense. If you accept Christianity you are considered a Christian, if you accept Islam you are considered a Muslim and if you convert to Buddhism you are considered Buddhist. It only shows that Jew is only the denomiator of those following Judaism.

**DinoDoc** · January 23, 2002, 16:35

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
IMHO the greatest diplomat of the 29th century would have to be FDR, Harry Truman or Dwight Eisenhower.

29th century?!? I had no idea that group of people was so well versed in keeping the Dominion in check while at the same time manging an alliance with the Klingon & Romulan Star Empires?

**Dr. Nick** · January 23, 2002, 16:37

Originally posted by The Andy-Man
He was an extreme imperialist (grew up in the late 19th C, fought in many African colonial wars), extremely conservative and right winged and many times needlessly brutal (rumours he deliberatly sent the lucitania into german waters to get the US in WW1, similar things have bin said bout pearl habour to).

Well, it was commonplace for the nobility to join the army or the navy and, extreme imperialist, it suited Britain's purposes and was iconic of British character at the time. And wasn't the Lusitania sunk off the coast of Ireland?

Churchill beleived in keeping the British empire at ALL costs, was very anti-Indian (called Ghandi a half naked faqir), refused to consider that ther empire had run its course and was supressing its peoples.

All the old time conservatives born into Empire believed in maintaining the Empire, it brought a lot of national prestige and wealth. He's an old school conservative remeber.

He spent most of his time drunk, and the only purpose he served in WW2 was to give Britain a John Bullish figure to look up to.

No comment.

IMO, Churchill represented EVERYthing that was bad about the British empire from the start of the New Imperialism till 1945.

Of course, the unbroken morale, the inspiration, the self sacrifice (and even if you tell me he didn't do all this he was still representative of it) was the worst thing of the British Empire.

**The Andy-Man** · January 23, 2002, 16:50

El Awrence, everything you said is what i hate bout the british empire post 1880. The reason i dont like Churchill is because he was one of the old school conservatives etc. up untill 1875ish, everything in thwe British empire was good. ok, not everything, but it truly was a center for libralism etc.

Also, with the empire bringing prestige etc, that was another point of the new imperialism whcich i thought sucked. Shouldn't the empire have been about the economic growth of Britain and her subjects (be they indian, african or english).

you can see, i have no love for the empire after 1880, except for Sherlock Holmes. the new imperialism was an age of hypocracy and opression and conservative thinking, so when you have THE John Bull being called the greatest politician of a century, when the whole later half (post 1945) always put down the British empire (normally for the right reason) and put down everything that the centuries hero represented, i get kinda pissed off and confused...

**Bugs ****ing Bunny** · January 23, 2002, 16:53

My memory might be failing me, but I'm sure Churchill won the Nobel Prize for Literature.

That's pretty good for a useless old drunk.

**The Andy-Man** · January 23, 2002, 17:01

i never said he was stupid. All credit to him for he mastery of the english language (speech, wit etc) but that dont = great person, other-wise hitler is a hero.

**Dr Strangelove** · January 23, 2002, 17:16

Originally posted by DinoDoc

29th century?!? I had no idea that group of people was so well versed in keeping the Dominion in check while at the same time manging an alliance with the Klingon & Romulan Star Empires?

Actually in the 29th century the Federation is busy tryiing to keep the timeline from being messed up.

But I meant 20th, OK?

**BeBMan** · January 23, 2002, 17:36

Originally posted by The Andy-Man
i never said he was stupid. All credit to him for he mastery of the english language (speech, wit etc) but that dont = great person, other-wise hitler is a hero.

What heroic things has he done?

**Bugs ****ing Bunny** · January 23, 2002, 18:33

Was Hitler noted for his English, or his wit?

Actually, that's a brilliant idea. Imagine if, right after he declared "Eine reich, eine volke, eine fuhrer" there was a snappy little rimshot on the drums and someone heckling "Get off! You're rubbish!". The world would have been a better place.

**DinoDoc** · January 23, 2002, 18:35

I knew what you meant.

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
But I meant 20th, OK?

I was just having a little fun with ya.

**Keygen** · January 24, 2002, 05:41

Originally posted by The Andy-Man
El Awrence, everything you said is what i hate bout the british empire post 1880. The reason i dont like Churchill is because he was one of the old school conservatives etc. up untill 1875ish, everything in thwe British empire was good. ok, not everything, but it truly was a center for libralism etc.

Whether a politian does the good or the bad thing is irrelevant.
A good polititian doesn't necessary mean being humanitarian.

And whether you like him or hate him is irrelevant too.

I didn't like either Kemal Attaturk but he was the greatest politian/leader of Turkey.

**Ecowiz Returns** · January 24, 2002, 07:16

So, let's list a few Great men:

Buda - not "Ferman"
Confucious - not "Ferman"
Jesus - not "Ferman", actually a Palestinian, born in Judeia (Bethlehem), raised in Judaism,... which makes him... a Jew (right?

)
S. Thomas Aquino - principal author of Catholic Philosofy an Theology; French; not "Ferman"
Socrates - not "Ferman"
Aristotles - not "Ferman"
Pithagoras - not "Ferman"
Arqhimedes - not "Ferman"
Copernicus - not "Ferman"
Galileo - not "Ferman"
Newton - not "Ferman"
Marco Polo - not "Fer...
Vasco da Gama - not ... (had to put one Portuguese)
Fernão de Magalhães - ... (hey, I'm starting to like this

)
Livingstone - ...
Cook - ...
Ben Franklin - ...
Thomas Jefferson - ...
Edison - ...
Marconi - ...
Alexander Bell - ...
Marie Curie - ...

The ones remembered by lightblue

"Anyway another option would be the English (Shakespeare, Milton, Dickens, Darwin, Churchill etc. etc.), the italians (Verdi, Dante, Da Vinci, Michelangelo etc. etc.) or the Dutch (Rembrandt, Van Gogh, Vermeer, Leeuwenhoeck etc. etc.). "

If you want, you can discard Churchil. There are plenty more in that group you can't discard!

Well, let's leave it like this.

If you find a list wiht german great men bigger than this i'll continue it. Deal?

**Eli** · January 24, 2002, 09:43

Originally posted by Ecowiz Returns
Jesus - not "Ferman", actually a Palestinian, born in Judeia (Bethlehem), raised in Judaism,... which makes him... a Jew (right?

)

How the hell can you call someone who lived 2000 years ago a "Palestinian" if the term exists only for 35 years?
Accept it, the "Palestinian" nationality exists for 30 years, and there is nothing different between a "Palestinian" and an Arab.

**Keygen** · January 24, 2002, 09:51

Originally posted by Eli

How the hell can you call someone who lived 2000 years ago a "Palestinian" if the term exists only for 35 years?
Accept it, the "Palestinian" nationality exists for 30 years, and there is nothing different between a "Palestinian" and an Arab.

Wasn't Jesus an Aramean (not sure for the spelling)?
Or was he Hebrew?

**Natan** · January 24, 2002, 09:56

Originally posted by Keygen

Wasn't Jesus an Aramean (not sure for the spelling)?
Or was he Hebrew?

He was Jewish, but his native language was almost certainly Aramaic, which was the language spoken in Roman Judea.

Announcement

Hitler Was Right....

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment