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EU Rules Against Microsoft

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  • #46
    Originally posted by aneeshm
    If I was in MS' shoes , I'd pull out of Europe . When they beg for you to come back ( don't forget , most EU governments run MS software ) , make them pay a very high price . That should force them to reconsider their anti-capitalist anti-free-market liberal-in-the-negative-sense statist laws .
    Anti-trust laws are purely free-market ones. The US had anti-trust laws for a very long time, because of their trust in the idea of the market, i.e healthy competition is in the interests of everybody.
    Capitalist countries with less trust in the principles of the market (like France) took a much, much longer time to adopt anti-trust laws. For the State either directly or indirectly managed trusts, and there were arrangements between them for their interests, and contrary to the consumer's interests.

    We have seen here a combination of rule of law + principles of free competition. You can hardly be more free-market than that.
    "I have been reading up on the universe and have come to the conclusion that the universe is a good thing." -- Dissident
    "I never had the need to have a boner." -- Dissident
    "I have never cut off my penis when I was upset over a girl." -- Dis

    Comment

    • #47
      Anti-trust is good. This application is stupid.

      Comment

      • #48
        Originally posted by Asher
        Is that why Windows revenue continues to increase every quarter while you proudly proclaim everyone is switching from Windows?
        Who knows if Windows revenue actually grows every quarter? Let me paraphrase Warren Buffett, "accounting tricks." However, it is a documented fact that more and more people are switching to Linux. You read the tech news, don't you?

        Originally posted by Asher
        It's time to escape the fantasy land of Chinese-Commie-Linux-Zealot and enter reality. It may be a bit harsh, but you're best off looking less like an idiot in the long-run in life.
        Ad hominem? Don't complain when I start returning the favour in the future.

        Originally posted by Asher
        You've been proclaiming that Linux is taking over since I came here, and since then Windows revenue is up somewhere aroun 25%.

        That's a pretty spectacular achievement for a platform that's dying to the obviously-very popular Linux desktop.
        25% increase over 5 years is extremely crappy for a monopoly. Thanks for making my point.
        (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
        (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
        (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

        Comment

        • #49
          "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
          Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

          Comment

          • #50
            Originally posted by aneeshm
            If I was in MS' shoes , I'd pull out of Europe . When they beg for you to come back ( don't forget , most EU governments run MS software ) , make them pay a very high price . That should force them to reconsider their anti-capitalist anti-free-market liberal-in-the-negative-sense statist laws .
            That will be totally awesome for us FOSS advocates. MS dropping out of Europe is just cutting its own throat. Go ahead.

            Clearly, Steve Ballmer has been in the business much longer than you and Asher combined and he thinks otherwise.

            Originally posted by aneeshm
            Anti-trust laws are a farce . If somebody refuses to hold your product because they think that it might impact their relationship with another product/company , deal with it.
            All I say is you really need to learn more about economics first.
            (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
            (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
            (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

            Comment

            • #51
              Originally posted by Asher
              Weak.
              (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
              (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
              (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

              Comment

              • #52
                Originally posted by Urban Ranger
                Weak.
                I agree, that's why I laughed.
                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                Comment

                • #53
                  Originally posted by Urban Ranger
                  That will be totally awesome for us FOSS advocates. MS dropping out of Europe is just cutting its own throat. Go ahead.

                  Clearly, Steve Ballmer has been in the business much longer than you and Asher combined and he thinks otherwise.
                  I understand it from a business perspective, and I'd have done the same thing as Ballmer did. Read what I said more carefully, ace.

                  Why does it matter if MS pulls out of Europe anyway, you'd have us believe everyone was switching.
                  "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                  Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                  Comment

                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Asher
                    I agree, that's why I laughed.
                    Your smilie indicates you had no counters. That's why I called your post weak.
                    (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
                    (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
                    (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

                    Comment

                    • #55
                      You mean the EU tried to #### an American software maker to promote their own industries, or because they can?

                      *GASP*!


                      Microsoft should tell them to go #### themselves-half the EU uses microsoft products illegally in goverment offices anyway...

                      Comment

                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Asher
                        The consumer benefits by having a default media player with their OS (it's stupid to not offer it).
                        In what sense does the consumer benefit?

                        Originally posted by Asher
                        Further, there is a competitive market -- unless you want to argue there are no alternatives for consumers.
                        Presence of alternatives does not mean the market is competitive.

                        Originally posted by Asher
                        Let's face it, modern day Apple and Linux zealots are abusing anti-trust laws as a crutch to dethrone a company they don't like, rather than providing the consumer the best products (for example, the idiots arguing IE should not ship by default with Windows).
                        Let me remind you that said company had been flagrantly ignoring the laws since who knows when. It even ignored a 1995 consent decree with the US DoJ. Who would have thought that they just ripped up something they signed themselves, just like that? Hmm?

                        Originally posted by Asher
                        My argument all along was that consumers should have basic services like Internet Browsers, FTP, File Browsers, and Media Players, but the option to get other ones.
                        How is Internet browsers in the same class as a local directory viewer?

                        Originally posted by Asher
                        IE6 killed Netscape because it was a superior product -- period.
                        IE3 was so much inferior than Netscape, and so was IE4. The thing was Microsoft had the money to burn while Netscape didn't. That's exactly what the original DoJ case against MS was based on.
                        (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
                        (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
                        (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

                        Comment

                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Urban Ranger
                          In what sense does the consumer benefit?
                          That they can play common files without jumping through hoops?

                          Presence of alternatives does not mean the market is competitive.
                          Explain how the market is not competitive if the presence of competition does not constitute competition.

                          How is Internet browsers in the same class as a local directory viewer?
                          Why are they in different classes? Both are considered essential services on modern computers that consumers need. Windows Explorer came about after third-party competition did, as did Internet Explorer.

                          IE3 was so much inferior than Netscape, and so was IE4. The thing was Microsoft had the money to burn while Netscape didn't.
                          This logic fails because Netscape 1.0, 2.0, and 3.0 also sucked ass. Netscape got venture capital from outside sources, MS got it from their resouces.
                          "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                          Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                          Comment

                          • #58
                            Are you still the only person willing to defend anticompetitive practices as a consumer benefit?
                            Only feebs vote.

                            Comment

                            • #59
                              I love the fact that Asher used the very same logic, but this time to oppose Apple's anti-competitive policies
                              "I have been reading up on the universe and have come to the conclusion that the universe is a good thing." -- Dissident
                              "I never had the need to have a boner." -- Dissident
                              "I have never cut off my penis when I was upset over a girl." -- Dis

                              Comment

                              • #60


                                Yeah, he's incapable of distinguishing anticompetitive monopolies from the rest. After over two years of being told as well.

                                Hopeless...
                                Only feebs vote.

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