News Flash: No Wmd In Iraq

[notyoueither]

Actually, the US had as much right to go into Iraq in 2002 as France did to go into Germany in 1937, but what is under discussion is the massaging of issues to get a democratic nation to willingly go to war.

[Agathon]

What Plato is arguing is nothing new. More like par for the course.

And the abject failure of this mentality to solve the world's problems is of course no real reason to stop.

The reason the UN was created was to stop or at least reduce this sort of behaviour. The people who founded it had a rare moment of clarity when they did so.

You'd think people would have learned by now.

[Ramo]

Yep, realism is morally bankrupt (hey Dino ).

[Agathon]

Does anyone have anything other than the cession of some political power to a transnational organization as a solution to the scourge of war?

There isn't any other feasible solution.

[chequita guevara]

International communist revolution.

[Agathon]

And that is not the transnational organizaton I had in mind, comrade?

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Agathon
Does anyone have anything other than the cession of some political power to a transnational organization as a solution to the scourge of war?

There isn't any other feasible solution.

Conquering the world?

[Agathon]

And how many times has that been tried, and with what success rate?

[Kuciwalker]

If at first you don't succeed...

OTOH, we could just nuke the planet.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Agathon
The left believe in some form of morality and human decency, the right believe in greed, power and dominance by whatever means they can get away with. If your case is "we can do what we want, so we will", then you are no better than OBL (but we all knew that).

There is a fundamental truth involved in any charge by the far left:

They are guilty of what they charge. Those charged are innocent.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Agathon

What Plato is arguing is nothing new. More like par for the course.

And the abject failure of this mentality to solve the world's problems is of course no real reason to stop.

The reason the UN was created was to stop or at least reduce this sort of behaviour. The people who founded it had a rare moment of clarity when they did so.

You'd think people would have learned by now.

Have you ever heard of the real reason for the Better Business Bureau?

[Spiffor]

I agree with Che's and Plato's case that the real reasons for this war were power-play. Unlike Plato, I give no benefit of the doubt whatsoever to the Bushies, who have willingly manipulated intelligence IMO, in order to bolster their propaganda machine*

I don't think the war in Iraq was in the US' (nor the West's) interest. It proved that even the most powerful military in the world had serious trouble undergoing a "walk in the park" (as Iraq should have been). It has divided the West, despite our common interests at avoiding the emergence of any new nuclear power, especially Iran. It has encouraged Iran to get nukes as soon as possible, while USUK troops are stuck in Iraq.

The only positive result is that a rebuilt Iraq will allow the US to pressure Saudi Arabia... Or even better, it may be possible to ruin Saudi Arabia

I absolutely don't think that a democratic Iraq will help reshaping the ME as a whole, by being an attractive "beacon of democracy". At least not for one generation or two. The political culture of Iraq won't allow a government that is simultaneously democratic, legitimate and powerful for a long time. The Iraqis will have to learn political compromise first, which doesn't come easily at all.

[Ned]

Hey, Spiffor. Is Che right that the Iraqi Commies could get 20% of the vote? They could be more powerful than any other party in the new legislature.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Ned
Hey, Spiffor. Is Che right that the Iraqi Commies could get 20% of the vote? They could be more powerful than any other party in the new legislature.

I'm don't know precisely how the Commies fare in Iraq, but Communist Parties are among the main opposition parties in ME dictatorships. It's reasonable to assume the Commies will get many votes in Iraq, but I don't know if they'll be the strongest individual party or not.

[Ned]

I wonder how the Iraqi Commies feel about the US? Most Commies hate the US, but I have a gut feeling that this may not be true of the Iraqi Commies.