Screw the IRS.

[Kaak]

Someone told me that if we said F*** the IRS, screw all the tax loopholes, writeoffs everything, the only write off to leave would be for donations to charities, everyone would pay about 14.5% income tax. Yes, i'm suggesting a flat tax.

the gov't would save the BILLIONS the IRS uses

[DRoseDARs]

Did you get audited?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Kaak
Someone told me . . .

Someone told me you were a fool, but I don't believe everything someone tells me. Someone frequently doesn't know what he's talking about.

For most people a flat tax would mean a massive increase in the amount of taxes they pay. I paid 8% on my income of $46K last year (not including SS). I'm not eager to nearly double it because you think it would be better.

[:) Smiley]

But where'd we create new jobs for all the people currently employed by the IRS?

[Tassadar500]

We'd kill them.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Smiley
But where'd we create new jobs for all the people currently employed by the IRS?

We could never get rid of the IRS, even if we did go to a flat tax system. Someone has to make sure people don't cheat on their taxes, even in a flat tax system. It would make their job easier, since a lot of the schemes that people think up to avoid taxes can take years to figure out.

Since they are massively understaffed, most people don't get caught right now. You have to be either unlucky or stupid to get caught cheating.

[Kaak]

che, my dad get's taxed at something like 40%. so, yeah, i think a flat tax would be a good thing...

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Kaak
che, my dad get's taxed at something like 40%.

That's likely the top marginal rate plus SS. Just because my top marginal rate is in the 24% zone doesn't mean I pay 24% income tax. As I mentioned previous, I paid 8% on my income taxes last year, after deductions and marginal tax rates were included, and I don't have really awesome deductions like a mortgage interest deduction or child credits. If I had two kids and a house, I wouldn't have paid any incomes tax last year, and I made above average wages. I'm in the top 50% when it comes to personal income (when I'm working).

You only pay marginal tax rates on your income above a certain level. When you add in deductions and such, it's highly unlikely your father is paying 40%. If he is, either he needs an account because he's messing up his taxes or he's got a private company (in which case he still needs an accountant).

I'm assuming you and he are counting social securty, which would exist with a flat tax as well, so you' still be paying an additional 6.5% or 13% (depending on whether you are self-employed or not) on top of your 14.5% flat rate. So you're still looking at a rate of between 21% and 27.5% under a certain level (it would diminish over the SS cap).

The highest tax bracket is 38%, IIRC. That's only on income over a certain level. Say you make a dollar more than the level that puts you over the top. Then you pay 38% on that dollar. Below that dollar you pay 33%, down to a certain level, then 24% down to a certain level, then 15% down to a certain level, etc.

I really can't foresee a situation where your father is paying 40% in income taxes, unless he's making obscene amounts of money, in which case he's got no sympathy from me.

so, yeah, i think a flat tax would be a good thing...

That's because you don't understand how income tax works.

[Kaak]

I really can't foresee a situation where your father is paying 40% in income taxes, unless he's making obscene amounts of money, in which case he's got no sympathy from me.

So it's fair for him to have to pay $70k in taxes a year, and you to pay $3680? I agree that he should pay more because he makes more, but not 18 times as much...I think the percentages should be the same, you shouldn't get penalized for earning potential.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Boohoo... your dad makes more so has to pay more in taxes... come on! What a silly thing to try to feel victimized by.

[Kaak]

did you read the part of that post where i said "I agree that he should pay more because he makes more"???

[Imran Siddiqui]

Yes, but you don't think he should pay a higher percentage because you feel like a wittle victim. BOOHOO! He makes more money, he should pay a higher percentage. He can afford it more than the poor guys getting screwed over (and who'll get more screwed over by a flat tax).

[Kaak]

explain to me how the poor guys are getting screwed over when they get to keep 92% of what they make, and people who make more only get to keep 65%?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Lets see... I'll make this very simple for you.

A person makes $1,000,000. 65% of that is $650,000.

A person makes $20,000 (around the poverty line). 92% of that is $18,400.

The poor guy can hardly make ends meet (if he can do it at all). He can't any retraining for a newer, better job because the government doesn't have the money to teach him new skills. He will always be on the lower end. His kids will be on the lower end. They may turn to crime, who knows, because the neighborhood the poor guy is living in has crappy schools, because property tax revenue low. And what hope is there of paying for his kid's college making so little?

Which one would you rather be?


I'm very far from being a socialist, but I find people who say it is 'fair' to have a flax tax to be utter morons in every sense of the word.

[Kaak]

sounds like you've got a lot of practise making excuses. My dad's dad was a preacher, and there were 8 kids in his family. That = very poor. And i know this requires initiative, but people can do things, learn in particular, without the help of the gov't. Besides, the lower end person's kids can get grants for school.