why 911 happend. Documentary on UK tv last night.

[chequita guevara]

Neo-con is the new demon word for the left, I take it? If you don't like some right-wing policy you just call them a neo-con? Considering how much Cold War foreign policy was opposed to what the neo-cons believe, i.e., crushing democracies abroad, avoiding a direct confrontation with the principle enemy, etc., one finds it difficult to understand why good old fashioned conservativsm is being retroactively branded neo-conservatism. Neo means new.

[MikeH]

The interpretation should be - bad as the soviets were, they were poor and incompetent and weren't as much of a threat to our way of life as we were led to believe by certain neo-cons.


Oh and of course the link with the way the Bush admin are doing the same thing today with muslim terrorists as the new enemy.

I'm not arguing in favour of that theory, just explaining what you should be attacking.

[chequita guevara]

There were no neo-cons during the Cold War.

[MikeH]

I didn't see the show.

[child of Thor]

True it seems no ruling power of any note seems keen to do the right thing

As a side issue, how easy would it be for our US posters to try to see this documentary? How easy is it to take VHS and put on the internet for example? I might contemplate doing this if its too hard - i think it worth the effort.

And this isnt a bash-usa/republican documentary - it also covers it from the arabic angle and questions the legitamacy of the suicide bomber and all that crowd. Its just that the Neo-cons come out as seriously scary people, the more so as they appear to have hijacked our democratic process

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


Which I interpret into meaning the Soviets weren't that bad... which I still think is foolish. If anything they were worse.

Their foreign policy was less destructive to the world in general.

[Fake Boris]

This documentary (seems) is spot-on. Fear is at the root of fascism and reactionary ideologies.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Neo-con is the new demon word for the left, I take it?

Yep... They don't take the time to understand the world as you have.

There were no neo-cons during the Cold War.

Well they weren't power is more accurate. They were around, just writing in journals (like 'Commentary') and the such .

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

There were no neo-cons during the Cold War.

Well they weren't power is more accurate. They were around, just writing in journals (like 'Commentary') and the such .

Fine, be a nitpick.

[Impaler[WrG]]

Isn't it Ironic Neo-Cons and Islamic Fundamentalism are each the Conservative wings of 2 different cultures and each is responsible for inflicting suffering both on their own society and that of the "Enemy" thus enshuring the creation/perpetuation of the conflict from which they draw their strength. It should be quite obvious to us that Conservatives be they dressed in suits or suicide belts are the enemy of all.

[Imran Siddiqui]

I'm a lawyer (well... law student). It's my job .

[Elok]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
The execution of Jesus is described as fake (as I mentionned). The sponge with vinegar, that was given to him when he said, "I am thirsty" contained some barbiturate. The Bible writes, soon after he got the "vinegar" he said his famous "Eli Eli lama asabthani" (I knew that some Apolytoner has his filthy hands in it - now where are you Eli??) and "died" = fell unconscious. This is very important, because otherwise by Roman law his legs would have been broken, which would have sealed his fate, because he would have suffocated from the pressure to his chest within minutes.

Er, it was my impression that in order to continue breathing on the cross you have to continuously pull yourself up by the nails through your wrists, scraping your back against a splintery beam in the process. When your strength fails, you drop back down and gasp for breath until you start thrashing in panic and pull yourself back up again. Intact legs can help to some extent by helping to push your body up, prolonging your pain until the moment when your whole body is too exhausted to lift yourself up for a breath. If you fall unconscious on the cross you're a dead man anyway, because you can't breathe in that slumped position. The "faked death" story is bogus.

[Dinner]

At the heart of the story are two groups: the American neoconservatives and the radical Islamists. Both were idealists who were born out of the failure of the liberal dream to build a better world.

This makes me question the whole program. Obviously he doesn't know squat about conservatives or where conservativism comes from.

Both these men believed that modern liberal freedoms were eroding the bonds that held society together.

I'll give the writer his point about Islamists not liking modern freedoms (I won't call them liberal) but he once again displays his ignorance of conservativism and its offshot neo-conservativism.

It basically seems the writer is trying to claim a false equivalency between Islamism and Consevativism which simply doesn't exist.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
The point being that the SU had no intent to go directly against America. America is the catalyst of the Cold War.

Really? Was Stalin that unkeen on spreading "the revolution" worldwide?

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
The point being that the SU had no intent to go directly against America. America is the catalyst of the Cold War.

So when Krusev tried to brow beat Kennedy into giving up east Berlin or the Soviets would invade is just a myth? It didn't happen? The Soviet backed coupes which occured in Greece and Turkey in 1946 were just the SU's way of being a good neighbor? Stalin's threat to invade Austria if it joined NATO was just a game he was playing?

Sorry kiddo but that doesn't make sense.