Bush is getting desperate in his campaign.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Drachasor


Hmm, no I just misunderstood Kerry's, I suppose. I thought I had heard him say something like that on an individual level.

Anyhow, here is a link to his plan:

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/health_care/

And there are more links on the right side to specific details.

He wants to cut waste, refund companies for the extremely expensive cases that can come up and drastically raise premiums. He wants them to have access to the same plans that Senators do, which IS NOT government-run healthcare. There would be tax-credits to help ease the cost as well.

When a private company is giving out the benefits, you do not have government-run healthcare.

-Drachasor

Drach, none of that addresses the needs of small business and poor. It instead offers the currently insured a government plan, which, of course, will ultimately result in a federal takeover.

[Drachasor]

Originally posted by Defiant


I know you want this all done in a FEDEX schedule but it takes time, these new recruits are also afraid, it takes time but it will happen.

They need more training, but they aren't going to get it.

The people with the 3-week course are DONE according the Bush administration. They have all the training they need.

This thing will take time, but all evidence indicates that Bush refused to acknowledge that. Internal reports indicating he wants to pull out after the election (if re-elected), unwilling to get the number of troops needed (eventually the military commanders have just stopped asking out of frustration), and not training the Iraqi forces enough, nor devoting enough energy to train them more rapidly.

This didn't have to be a quagmire, but the Administration's attitude caused it to be so.

-Drachasor

[Drachasor]

Originally posted by Ned
Drach, none of that addresses the needs of small business and poor. It instead offers the currently insured a government plan, which, of course, will ultimately result in a federal takeover.

Maybe you need to actually read the links I provide:

A Plan For Stronger, Healthier Businesses

Today, America's businesses face daunting challenges in providing employees with quality health care at affordable prices. The national health care system is riddled with waste and inefficiency, making it unreasonably expensive for employers to keep their workers covered and their businesses growing.

John Kerry and John Edwards believe that businesses should not have to compromise on coverage to stay competitive. By helping businesses reduce their costs, the Kerry-Edwards plan will provide relief for America's employers and workers.

Cut Premiums By Up To $1,000 For America's Workers. Paying for catastrophic care can pose enormous problems for businesses, especially small and medium-sized ones. Catastrophic injuries and illnesses are impossible to predict, and caring for them is extremely expensive. As a result, a single catastrophic case can drastically raise the price of health insurance for all the employees of a small business. To ease the burden of businesses in caring for catastrophic cases, the Kerry-Edwards plan will reimburse businesses for 75 percent of the cost of catastrophic care.

Taxes Credits To Cut The Cost Of Health Insurance By Up To 50 Percent. Under the Kerry-Edwards plan, small businesses will receive tax credits to help them provide health insurance for their low and moderate-income employees. The tax credit will cover up to 50 percent of the cost of the employers' share of the premiums. To be eligible, an employer offering the new Kerry-Edwards Congressional Health Plan will have to pay at least 50 percent of the health insurance premium.

Cut Administrative Costs By Eliminating Waste, Fraud And Abuse. Today, about 25 percent of the annual cost of health care goes towards non-medical costs - mainly paperwork and other costs associated with preparing, submitting, calculating, and paying bills. Due to these costs, settling a single transaction can cost as much as $12 to $25. By comparison, a transaction in the banking industry costs less than a penny.

Harnessing the power of America's ingenuity and technological know-how, the Kerry-Edwards plan will save billions every year by:

* Ensuring that all Americans have secure, private medical records by 2008, which will eliminate unnecessary tests and reduce serious medical errors by as much as 88 percent.
* Giving health providers technology bonuses to simplify and streamline their paperwork - allowing patients to spend more time with doctors and less time filling out forms.
* Require insurers doing business with the federal government to use advanced systems. To make health care transactions less costly, private insurers would have to use this simplified technology standard as a condition of doing business with the Federal government (Medicare, Medicaid, and the Federal Employees Health Benefit Program).

Reduce Medical Malpractice Premiums. As president, John Kerry will require that a qualified specialist certifies a medical malpractice case's merit before it is allowed to move forward. He will also work with states to ensure the availability of non-binding mediation in all malpractice claims before cases proceed to trial. John Kerry will make the system fairer for doctors and patients alike by preventing and punishing frivolous lawsuits. Lawyers who file frivolous cases would face tough, mandatory sanctions, including a "three strikes and you're out" provision that forbids lawyers who file three frivolous cases from bringing another suit for the next 10 years. John Kerry also opposes punitive damages - unless intentional misconduct, gross negligence, or reckless indifference to life can be established. Finally, John Kerry will work to eliminate the special privileges that allow insurance companies to fix prices and collude in ways that increase medical malpractice premiums.

Improve The Efficiency And Quality Of Care To Cut Administrative Costs. In the health care system, inefficiency and negligence can lead to serious injury and even death - as well as higher costs. A recent study by the Institute of Medicine found that between 44,000 and 98,000 people die of medical errors every year. These tragedies are preventable. The vast majorities of injuries are not caused by negligent doctors or hospitals, but because of outmoded practices, habits and systems that fail to adequately protect patients from harmful errors.

The Kerry-Edwards plan will offer a "quality bonus," enabling purchasers and providers to use upfront capital to upgrade quality and reduce errors to improve outcomes. It will also ensure that health care organizations and physicians that invest in advanced information technology are rewarded with financial incentives, including the funds needed to install computerized prescribing systems, which can reduce medication errors by 80 percent or more.

-Drachasor

[Ned]

Drach, I see no plan to cover the poor. Giving tax credits helps everyone, not just small business. Offering a federal plan for catastophic health insurance reduces everyone's health insurance cost, not just those of small business.

Since Kerry proposes to raise taxes on the wealthy to pay for this, all this amounts to is just another income transfer mechanism well associated with liberalism.

Bush's plan is focused on the need, not on a Federal takeover or wealth redistribution.

[Japher]

Ned

Hell, if we install Kerrys plan there will be issues in 10 years about how there is this huge "healtcare tax shelter", people misusing credits, overspending on the subcommitee for the oversight committe for the arbritator of the medical fraud organization, etc...

Ain't much of plan as it costs a lot to impliment, and he won't be able to perform without raising taxes.

[Drachasor]

Originally posted by Ned
Drach, I see no plan to cover the poor. Giving tax credits helps everyone, not just small business. Offering a federal plan for catastophic health insurance reduces everyone's health insurance cost, not just those of small business.

Since Kerry proposes to raise taxes on the wealthy to pay for this, all this amounts to is just another income transfer mechanism well associated with liberalism.

Bush's plan is focused on the need, not on a Federal takeover or wealth redistribution.

Bush has no clear plan for helping the poor. Kerry gives actual figures.

Again, read the website (there is some repetition in the below because some things affect multiple people):

A Plan For Stronger, Healthier Families And Children

John Kerry and John Edwards believe that all American families are entitled to the security and peace of mind that comes from knowing their families have the coverage they need to stay healthy - without breaking the bank.

Over the last three years, the cost of family health insurance has increased by more than $3,512, and the portion paid by families has increased by almost 64 percent. Even today, millions of children lack basic coverage. John Kerry and John Edwards have a plan to cut health care costs for families, cut waste from the system, and ensure access to reliable, affordable coverage for 95 percent of Americans, including every American child.

Cut Family Premiums By Up To $1,000 For American Workers. Under the Kerry-Edwards plan, employers will benefit from offering their employees quality care with choices. By helping out with certain high-cost cases, the Kerry-Edwards plan will cut premiums by up to $1,000 per year for America's families.

Cover All Children And Millions More Adults. By extending state-based programs, the Kerry-Edwards plan will pick up the full cost of coverage for the more than 20 million children enrolled in Medicaid. In exchange, states would expand coverage for families up to 200 percent of poverty and for childless adults up to 100 percent of poverty. As a result, the Kerry-Edwards plan will extend reliable coverage to:

* 26.7 million Americans who are currently uninsured
* 95 percent of all Americans
* Every child

Help All Americans Buy Into The Same Coverage As Members Of Congress. The Kerry-Edwards plan will give all Americans access to the same range of affordable plans currently available to members of Congress. This will provide more choices and better, more affordable coverage than is generally available to people without high-quality, employer-sponsored insurance.

Cut Prescription Drug Costs. In the last year alone, prescription drug prices have risen by 17 percent, a major cause of skyrocketing health insurance costs. To dramatically reduce the cost of prescription drugs, the Kerry-Edwards plan will overhaul the current Medicare bill to:

* Allow re-importation of Prescription Drugs to give Americans access to the substantial discounts available in Canada.
* End artificial barriers to generic drug competition.
* Require the Secretary of Health and Human Services to negotiate better prices for prescription drugs, instead of paying whatever the drug companies choose to charge.
* Require transparency rules for Pharmacy benefit managers (PBMs) that do business with the Federal government. PBMs process hundreds of millions of pharmaceutical claims per year and manage drug benefits for more than 200 million Americans. Under the Kerry-Edwards plan, companies will be required to reveal the profits they make from the drug industry and show that discounts are being passed on to seniors.
* Help states provide discounts by giving them incentives to implement more efficient contracting in order to obtain better rates for prescription drugs.

Reduce Medical Malpractice Premiums. As president, John Kerry will require that a qualified specialist certifies a medical malpractice case's merit before it is allowed to move forward. He will also work with states to ensure the availability of non-binding mediation in all malpractice claims before cases proceed to trial. John Kerry will make the system fairer for doctors and patients alike by preventing and punishing frivolous lawsuits. Lawyers who file frivolous cases would face tough, mandatory sanctions, including a "three strikes and you're out" provision that forbids lawyers who file three frivolous cases from bringing another suit for the next 10 years. John Kerry also opposes punitive damages -- unless intentional misconduct, gross negligence, or reckless indifference to life can be established. Finally, John Kerry will work to eliminate the special privileges that allow insurance companies to fix prices and collude in ways that increase medical malpractice premiums.

Cut Taxes To Make Health Insurance More Affordable. The Kerry-Edwards plan will provide $177 billion in tax credits to make health care more affordable for people and businesses that buy into the new Congressional Health Plan. These credits include:

* A 25 percent credit for seniors aged 55 to 64 whose salaries fall below 300 percent of poverty.
* A 75 percent credit for people between jobs and whose salaries fall below 300 percent of poverty.
* A tax credit of up to 50 percent for small businesses that cover low-to-moderate income workers.
* A tax credit for workers not eligible for other provisions of the Kerry-Edwards plan. This credit would limit premiums to less than 6 percent of income for workers below poverty, then phase out to 12 percent of income for workers at 300 percent of poverty.

Cut Administrative Costs By Eliminating Waste, Fraud And Abuse. Today, about 25 percent of the annual cost of health care goes towards non-medical costs - mainly paperwork and other costs associated with preparing, submitting, calculating, and paying bills. Due to these costs, settling a single transaction can cost as much as $12 to $25. By comparison, a transaction in the banking industry costs less than a penny. Harnessing the power of American ingenuity and technological know-how, the Kerry-Edwards plan will save billions every year by:

* Ensuring that all Americans have secure, private medical records by 2008, which will eliminate unnecessary tests and reduce serious medical errors by as much as 88 percent.
* Giving health providers technology bonuses to simplify and streamline their paperwork - allowing patients to spend more time with doctors and less time filling out forms.
* Require private sector insurers to use advanced systems. To make health care transactions less costly, private insurers would have to use this simplified technology standard as a condition of doing business with the Federal government (Medicare, Medicaid, and the Federal Employees Health Benefit Program).

Giving Patients Real Protections Through A Real, Enforceable Patients' Bill Of Rights. The Bush administration has continued blocking bipartisan efforts to pass a Patients' Bill of Rights in Congress. They also sent their lawyers to the Supreme Court to stand with the HMOs and argue against giving patients the right to sue HMOs. As president, John Kerry will push for a real Patients' Bill of Rights to protect Americans from HMO decisions that harm patients by denying them necessary medical care - one that ensures patients have access to reliable, high-quality health care. Critical patient protections John Kerry and John Edwards will support include:

* A right to see the specialists they need
* A right to real emergency protections
* A real external appeals process that allows patients to appeal a HMO decision
* A right to hold health plans accountable
* Whistleblower protections that allow health care workers to report quality problems without fear of retaliation

All Bush says is that he'll make programs for the poor. He gives no indication of what they will be like. He gives no indication of how he will pay for his programs. Kerry's tax-rollbacks for the rich will fully cover his health-care proposal.

Also, half of what Bush says has already been done, so it will already be part of what life will be like under Kerry's administration.

I'll take the candidate with detailed proposals and a plan to pay for them, especially over the one that has consistently favored corporations' profit margins over the American people on health-care.

-Drachasor

[Drachasor]

Originally posted by Japher
Ned

Hell, if we install Kerrys plan there will be issues in 10 years about how there is this huge "healtcare tax shelter", people misusing credits, overspending on the subcommitee for the oversight committe for the arbritator of the medical fraud organization, etc...

Ain't much of plan as it costs a lot to impliment, and he won't be able to perform without raising taxes.

Yeah, but the tax-rollbacks cover the whole thing easily, and Kerry has a plan on how to afford it.

Bush spends money wildly, and has no fiscal responsibility.

-Drachasor

[Japher]

Yeah, but the tax-rollbacks cover the whole thing easily, and Kerry has a plan on how to afford it

Really?

Bush spends money wildly, and has no fiscal responsibility.

I will agree to an extent.

Still, Kerry has not addressed how he is going to cover all these costs specifically. What else is he spending money on? Will the rollback cover those costs?

I seriously doubt the rollback will cover even the healthcare costs.

[Drachasor]

Originally posted by Japher
I will agree to an extent.

Still, Kerry has not addressed how he is going to cover all these costs specifically. What else is he spending money on? Will the rollback cover those costs?

I seriously doubt the rollback will cover even the healthcare costs.

He has detailed the spending, and non-partisan groups have gone over his proposal.

The roll-back will fully cover the Healthcare costs, and perhaps then some.

Kerry is someone that believes in showing where the money is coming from for new proposals, and he does do that.

-Drachasor

[Defiant]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
Call it "Saddams backyard" all you want, the fact remains, that the people there hate the guts out of you and more than willingly give the resistors and the terrorists (I draw a line between them) food and shelter. The north is largely Kurdish and quiet as long as you respect their wish for relative autonomy. The Shiite south has seen uprisings (El Sadr comes to mind) and will see them again, it's just a matter of time.

If you are right and the majority of the people hate us and they are the remnents of Saddam, they are our enemy and we should do what we did to Dresdon, correct. We fire bomb 1/4 of Falluja I guarrantee the rest will no longer resist.

You will not see El Sadr again unless we hit Iran and there becomes a Shiite backlash, which will have to squash then, this a long endeavor, make no mistake about it.

[Arrian]

If you are right and the majority of the people hate us and they are the remnents of Saddam, they are our enemy and we should do what we did to Dresdon, correct. We fire bomb 1/4 of Falluja I guarrantee the rest will no longer resist.

You are out of your ****ing mind.

-Arrian

[Defiant]

Originally posted by Arrian


You are out of your ****ing mind.

-Arrian

Am I, or is it people make such remarkable statements that it require remarkable statments.
This is a war, isn't it? Should we use harsh language to people that behead civilians.

[Gibsie]

Defiant is right. The only way to pacify these barbarians is to kill them and their families, children and anyone else that gets in the way. But why stop at 1/4? Go for 100% kill and then there'll be no-one left for them to teach their hatred to.

[Arrian]

You think that firebombing a city would reduce resistance?

Maybe from that city, since most of 'em would be dead, but the rest of the country would erupt.

-Arrian

[Drachasor]

Originally posted by Defiant
If you are right and the majority of the people hate us and they are the remnents of Saddam, they are our enemy and we should do what we did to Dresdon, correct. We fire bomb 1/4 of Falluja I guarrantee the rest will no longer resist.

They might be demoralized for a while, but the resistance over all of Iraq and the Middle East would grow tremendously.

Policies like that make a hell of a lot more terrorists, they don't reduce the numbers.

You are not being pragmatic or realistic; your ideology would cause problems and is not part of a solution.

-Drachasor