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Originally posted by Kidicious The monetary system was created so that people could consume goods and services without doing any work.
No, the monetary system was used so that there would be a convenient way of measuring the value of items, as well as a convenient way of "storing" labor - that is, I can sell something now, but I don't have to get some product in return for what I sold until later, and I can get it from a different person.
Originally posted by FredKarno
Marx was a power-mad-nutter.
Money. A tool. Impossible to imagine 'civilisation' evolving without it.
Like all tools, subject to abuse and misuse. Witness this thread!
Like all tools, it is about power. This money not simple tool. Therfore very complex arguments about it.
Like it or not, the worship of power overrides all. You who argue about this money tool without considering the worship of power are fools.
Those who deride money the most are socialists who worship power the most!
Moron
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett Kavanaugh
Originally posted by Japher
I haven't taken economics since 1993...
Though I play the markets a lot and study a lot about personal finances... which has nothing to do with macro economics. Still, if DanS agrees with me, I know it's right. Him and Adam Smith.
Sucker
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett Kavanaugh
Your money did not create candy bars, in the sense that little green slips of paper do not create candy bars, nor do bits in a computer in a bank.
However, money effectively equals capital or labor (in that it can be freely exchanged for either), and both of those DO create candy bars. Therefore, your money effectively creates candy bars.
A bond recieves and interest. The issuers use the proceeds to purchase machinery and so forth. The issuers did not create that machinery and either did the buyers of the bond. The machinery was created by labor.
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett Kavanaugh
No, the monetary system was used so that there would be a convenient way of measuring the value of items, as well as a convenient way of "storing" labor - that is, I can sell something now, but I don't have to get some product in return for what I sold until later, and I can get it from a different person.
True, you have to measure things to make sure that someone else does all the work.
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett Kavanaugh
Originally posted by Kidicious
The machines were created and operated by labor. Land doesn't create things.
Land = resources (metals, wood, oil, etc.) which are as necessary as labor and capital for creation of goods.
And when land is used for farming, it is capital (a great big machine for making food), and therefore does make things (when coupled with labor).
The word 'make' or 'create,' those are verbs. Verbs show action. Land doesn't perform any action regarding the goods and services performed on it. Land 'creates' goods and services doesn't make any sense. Even you should know that.
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett Kavanaugh
Originally posted by FredKarno
Dear Kidicious,
Does not your short reply to my post prove that you don't? How can we be equal when there is abuntant proof that we are not?
Oh....I forget. My soul has not been engineered yet. Pardon me.
We aren't equal. You are just a DL.
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett Kavanaugh
what the blazes does 'DL' mean? Diabolical Loony perhaps? No idea(though quite right). More proof that we are utterly unequal. Therfore I win this argument by default and you should crawl into your hole and hide foreaver forth, not daring to type ever again into this internet thingy. Thus we anti-socialists win totally and conquer you. Hmnnn....let's see....
OK, but the specialist produced the work, the perception didn't.
So what? You're ignoring the issue. The specialist perceived that there was a value in laboring for a certain purpose, in exchange for a certain wage. While you might think that he misjudged value, the specialist doesn't care. The company paying him doesn't care what you think, either, because the only thing relevant about value is what the two contracting parties agree on.
I don't see how you arrive at this conclusion. Especially seen as commonly to get money you have to get paid wages.
I'm sort of messing around with Kuciwalker. I don't consider that part of the debate serious. However, the creators of the monetary system mostly never recieved wages I think.
FredKarno,
What's your story? I still think your a DL.
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett Kavanaugh
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The monetary system was created so that people could consume goods and services without doing any work.
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