John Kerry the war criminal: Unfit to command, part 2

[Ned]

GePap, 1 - 2 - 3 - 4, what the hell are we fighting for?

This was a good question when Johnson was president since Johnson appeared to have no strategy for victory, but offered only endless slaughter.

Nixon had a plan, but Kerry and others like him worked as hard as possible to defeat that plan and force a unilateral withdrawal. In addition, Kerry smeared our troops and undermined them while combat still raged.

Similar to what he did when he voted against funding our troops in Iraq.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Ned


According to the Times, Adm. Hoffmann and others were generally supportive of Kerry until they saw his biography realized just how much he was lying about what happened during his "Tour of Duty."

And that information came about independently, or based on the statements of Hoffman and his buddies?

In other words, what incentive would they have to say "hey, we've hated this ******* since he became a traitor and shacked up with Hanoi Jane:ATB^tm but we haven't said anything about it until now?"

That doesn't sound as credible as "hey, we liked the guy (even though we thought he was really a gutless piece of **** who we now claim we gave bogus meddles to get him out of our command, but yeah, let's ignore the inconsistency of those claims with our saying we liked the guy), and it didn't matter what he did during the war that we now condemn, and it didn't matter what he said as a leader of VVAW, and it has nothing to do with getting vocal three months before an election, but when we read his book and saw what he said about us, enough was enough, so now we're finally telling the truth about the gutless scumbag who we really liked despite the thang with Hanoi Jane, at least until we read his book."



They just don't have a good story for why today's story is so much different from the stories for the last 35 years.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Ned


I did read it GePap. It is clear that Kerry himself brought this down on his own head by attacking Admiral Hoffman in his biography. No doubt, the group he formed was helped along by certain "Texans" that had an interest in the matter. But that doesn't change the reality that Kerry smeared Hoffmann and is the primary reason for Hoffman organizing the Swiftboat Veterans.

So now that it's uncontested that the motivation is Hoffman's personal vendetta, we can all go home.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Ned
GePap, 1 - 2 - 3 - 4, what the hell are we fighting for?

This was a good question when Johnson was president since Johnson appeared to have no strategy for victory, but offered only endless slaughter.

Nixon had a plan, but Kerry and others like him worked as hard as possible to defeat that plan and force a unilateral withdrawal. In addition, Kerry smeared our troops and undermined them while combat still raged.

Nixon's "secret plan to end the war" So secret he couldn't tell anyone, and let the war continue for his entire first term. And if everyone waved the flag and cheered like the good ol' righties wanted then, Nixon would have had no incentive to get out when he did. Nixon got out for political expediency when the popular support for the war affected him.

Similar to what he did when he voted against funding our troops in Iraq.

Ah, Operation Infinite Pork.

I agree Kerry was wrong - what the Congress should have done was demand more forces and a clearcut plan for occupation before defaulting into Bush's lack of a plan.

[The Emperor Fabulous]

John Kerry has filed a lawsuit with the FEC contending that the ads are misleading and connected illegally with the Bush campaign

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
The last of 3 exceprts of the book as reported by the Washington Times

Mmmm, Moonie paper. Well, I guess we should believe the paper that's owned by the reincarnation of Jesus Christ.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by The Emperor Fabulous
John Kerry has filed a lawsuit with the FEC contending that the ads are misleading and connected illegally with the Bush campaign

I don't think he really wants to do that. It opens up the books on MoveOn and other 527s allied with his campaign.

[Ned]

MtG, I don't understand why you are disagreeing with the NYTimes, Kerry's biggest supporter. The Times cited chapter and verse where most of the Swift Vets said very nice things about Kerry, including Hoffman himself, until they got wind of Kerry's book.

As to Nixon's plan, well it was "Vietnamization."

It worked.

But it would have worked faster had Kerry (and Jane Fonda and the rest of the pro-commie "anti-war" movement) hadn't encouraged the North to believe that all they had to do is wait and the US would unilaterally withdraw.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Ned
As to Nixon's plan, well it was "Vietnamization."

Nixon's secret plan to end the war was to try and win it. Four years, and 24,000 dead Americans later, we agreed to the same peace treaty that Nixon sank in '68.

[Lincoln]

Kerry is a typical Democrat. Go to the courts to stifle your opponants. Maybe Edwards can argue the case before the Supreme Court for him. At least now this issue will get the press it deservs. Kerry is digging his own grave just like Gore did. The man is pure scum.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Ned
MtG, I don't understand why you are disagreeing with the NYTimes, Kerry's biggest supporter. The Times cited chapter and verse where most of the Swift Vets said very nice things about Kerry, including Hoffman himself, until they got wind of Kerry's book.

I'm not disagreeing with the times, I'm questioning the credibility of the vets who had nothing but nice things to say, and now Kerry is suddenly the anti-Christ incarnate? If I think someone's an *******, I don't have to wait until he publishes a book before I stop saying what a nice guy I think he is, and start saying what an ******* I think he is.

As to Nixon's plan, well it was "Vietnamization."

You mean finally let the ARVN ****ups continue to **** up while 25,000 more of our troops were KIA?

It worked.

Yeah. That's why they call Saigon "Ho Chi Minh City" right? If the goal of Nixon's great plan was to have the ARVN fold in two years, we could have just said "**** it, Ho, will you stop shooting at us for 90 days so we can get the hell out of Dodge, and then you can do what you want?" We would have saved four years, and 25,000 American lives and gotten the same net result.

But it would have worked faster had Kerry (and Jane Fonda and the rest of the pro-commie "anti-war" movement) hadn't encouraged the North to believe that all they had to do is wait and the US would unilaterally withdraw.

I don't think Ho needed to be convinced in that regard. He'd already figured out the plan with the French after Dien Bien Phu. And Kerry and Hanoi Jane sure as hell can't be blamed for the ineptitude and corruption of the RVN government and ARVN forces.

[Lincoln]

What do you think of Jane Fonda and her ilk, MTG.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Lincoln
What do you think of Jane Fonda and her ilk, MTG.

'

Great American heros!

Interesting tidbit. During the war, the Navy decided that they didn't want an antiwar protestor doing performances for the troops, so the canceled her appearance on the U.S.S. Forrestal (IIRC). Considering that so many vets consider Hanoi Jane to be a traitor, you'd have throught that was the end of it. No. Interestingly enough, the crew of the Forrestal went on strike until the Navy relented and allowed Fonda to perform.

[Ned]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Nixon's secret plan to end the war was to try and win it. Four years, and 24,000 dead Americans later, we agreed to the same peace treaty that Nixon sank in '68.

Che, how many times do I have to spike this outright lie?

[Ned]

MtG, the plan was to force a peace treaty, get our POWs back and withdraw. The North wanted us to hand them the keys to Saigon as their price to give us the POWs. What Kerry did was delay for years any chance for our POWs to be set free, and as result caused an additional 20,000+ KIA. The blood of many Americans drips from Kerry's hands.

Face it MtG, you are backing a traitor.