Abstinence Bush Admin's Answer to AIDS

[DinoDoc]

'a clear message that the best means of preventing HIV/Aids is to avoid risk altogether'

The fault with this msg is?

[Pekka]

Harry Tuttle, thanks for the link. That's pretty recent too LIke always, there's been lot of these in the past but yet I'm hopeful for this one. The fact is, the cure, or some kind of prevention drug is bound to be developed in our lifetime, so it just as well could be now.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by DinoDoc

'a clear message that the best means of preventing HIV/Aids is to avoid risk altogether'

The fault with this msg is?

It doesn't prevent the spread of AIDS. You might as well be telling people that the best way of preventing terrorism is to not build skyscrapers and airplanes.

The goal of the movement to stop the spread of AIDS is the actual stop of the spread of AIDS. Talking people into using a condom is hard, but it's much more likely to succeed than talking people into not having sex.

Even if you hate sex for some reason and wish people didn't have it, it's very hard to argue that, given equal funding, AIDS would spread less after a pro-abstinence campaign than a after a pro-condom campaign.

[David Floyd]

So, you don't give a **** that the Bush Administration is condemning hundreds of millions of Africans to a hellish death?

Actually I don't give a **** - those people are condemning themselves to death by having unsafe sex with multiple partners of questionable health. I shouldn't have to ****ing pay for their bad decisions - they sure as hell don't pay for mine.

[cia]

I had my first child with the form of AIDS control some of you syncophants agree with, so abstinance might just be the best policy!

[St Leo]

Originally posted by David Floyd
Actually I don't give a **** - those people are condemning themselves to death by having unsafe sex with multiple partners of questionable health. I shouldn't have to ****ing pay for their bad decisions - they sure as hell don't pay for mine.

Sure they do. They pay for your decision to live in the suburbia, to waste water watering an ugly lawn, to drive an internal combustions vehicle, to use electronic appliances when a rolled up sleeve and some sweat would do, to buy cash crop groceries, and to buy sweat shop manufactures.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by cia
I had my first child with the form of AIDS control some of you syncophants agree with, so abstinance might just be the best policy!

Abstinence isn't a policy. Abstinence is the absence of policy.

Also, assuming you meant sycophant in the sense of suck-up, brown-noser, ass-kisser, flatterer, and yes-person, who's sucking up to who in this thread?

[cia]

Abstinence is merely a lack of policy in your eyes St Leo. In mine it is merely a scientific fact if you do not place your schlong in a woman's happy place, you do not catch cooties, to use the vernacular. It is impossible to catch a communicable disease by not being in communication with one who carries the disease. Also known as, DUH!

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by David Floyd


Actually I don't give a **** - those people are condemning themselves to death by having unsafe sex with multiple partners of questionable health. I shouldn't have to ****ing pay for their bad decisions - they sure as hell don't pay for mine.

Quite apart from the point that many African AIDS victims had precious little choice about engaging in unsafe sex, you're gonna pay anyway when collapsing societies drags the world economy down.

[cia]

Um, note to self Last Conformist. Please list the world trade figures for any country in Africa and let me know how much the world economy is dragged down. Any issues with the world economy are due to the first world attempting to help Africa out of its death spiral.

[David Floyd]

St Leo,

Sure they do. They pay for your decision to live in the suburbia

No they don't - that's something I pay for. And I don't actually live in suburbia - my parents do. And that's something they pay for. But it makes no difference to some poor dumb bastard in New Guinea if I live in South Central LA or the suburbs of Chicago - they're still poor.

to waste water watering an ugly lawn,

As if that water would be shipped over there anyway
Besides, I don't have a lawn

to drive an internal combustions vehicle,

Hell, if you wanna use the argument that pollution harms them - well, I live in it, so it harms me more. If you wanna argue that competition for oil harms them, then my answer is free trade and globalism. And yes, I freely admit that not everyone will benefit equally from it - the same as anything else.

to use electronic appliances when a rolled up sleeve and some sweat would do,

Again, not hurting anyone. I'm paying the electric bill. I could NOT pay the electric bill, but that'd be stealing. Or I could not have electricity, which would just make me weird. And hot. Buying electricity is simply paying for a good/service that happens to be plentiful. I'm sorry that there is no electricity in the average home in Botswana, but that really isn't my problem - and I'm not sure you can export electricity, anyway

to buy cash crop groceries,

Yes, I suppose starving would be better, or eating substandard food when I can easily afford the good stuff. Whatever.

and to buy sweat shop manufactures.

So having a job that pays a little as opposed to having no job is somehow harmful?

Look, there are starving people in the world. There are poor people in the world. They're getting ****ed by life. Actually, they're mostly just getting ****ed by their authoritarian governments, whether it's in the guise of communism, socialism, or a military dictatorship. If they'd grow some balls and do something about the corrupt pieces of **** ruling them, then perhaps they'd be a little better off. But don't ask me to (excuse me, force me to) help people who aren't really even trying to help themselves in the long term.

And don't ask me to feel guilty for living in the US and being extremely wealthy relative to 90% of the world's population. Save your breath - I don't feel a bit bad about my situation. There are people better off than me, and people worse off than me. Guess how many of those people I'm ultimately responsible for - NONE! I'm responsible for myself and my own actions - I'm not responsible for others or their actions. When I'm a warlord in Somalia taking food from starving mothers, you can hold me responsible for perpetuating poverty. But I'm not that - I'm simply a college student in a country that has maintained a tradition of freedom (relative to much of the world) and as a result, is prosperous. That tradition is also largely in place elsewhere in the world - you know, oddly enough, the more free a nation is, the more prosperous it tends to be. Look at the 20 poorest nations of the world - I bet none of them are free, liberal nations, are they? Uh-uh. They're ****holes run by *******s populated by people who are apparently not trying to do anything about their situation.

And before you go off on a tangent about colonialism being the root of all those ills, it bears mentioning that without colonialism, most of the world that was colonized would be quite a bit worse off. That doesn't justify the ills of colonialism, but blaming colonialism for starvation and poverty is not the logical connection you probably think it is.

Abstinence isn't a policy. Abstinence is the absence of policy.

You can't deny that abstinence would stop the spread of STDs, now can you? Given that fact, it also stands to reason that increased levels of abstinence and abstinence based education would also reduce the spread of STDs, right? Now, don't get me wrong - I don't oppose telling people to use condoms, but it's only honest to tell them that the only way to GUARANTEE they won't get an STD is to, well, not have sex, or at least not have sex with multiple unclean partners. Duh.

LC,

Quite apart from the point that many African AIDS victims had precious little choice about engaging in unsafe sex, you're gonna pay anyway when collapsing societies drags the world economy down.

Sorry, but I don't think that the collapse of Ethiopia or the Sudan is going to cause me to miss any meals, or even to have to buy sirloin instead of filet mignon

Liberals

[David Floyd]

Even if you hate sex for some reason and wish people didn't have it, it's very hard to argue that, given equal funding, AIDS would spread less after a pro-abstinence campaign than a after a pro-condom campaign.

People make their own decisions. Ain't my fault they make the wrong ones, especially when I freely give them all the information they need to make the right one.

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by cia
Um, note to self Last Conformist. Please list the world trade figures for any country in Africa and let me know how much the world economy is dragged down. Any issues with the world economy are due to the first world attempting to help Africa out of its death spiral.

If Africa were more prosperous, they'd buy more of our stuff, leaving us all better off. Right now, they're mostly a sink.

Africa, as such, isn't, btw, in any "death spiral", altho some bits are.

[cia]

Please inform me of the countries in Africa performing in a growth phase economically and a decline phase healthwise and I will be glad to send some help in the form of economic aid for more condoms.

[David Floyd]

If Africa were more prosperous, they'd buy more of our stuff, leaving us all better off. Right now, they're mostly a sink.

And I thought you were talking about how the world economy would be grossly affected by the collapse of African nations. But then you turn around and say that they aren't prosperous enough to import much, meaning that the economic collapse of Eritrea would concern the world economy not in the least.