Fil Canadien D'Élection (Partie Trois)

[notyoueither]

**** off, Tingkai, I'm in no mood for your idiotic games.

[Tingkai]

No NYE, why don't you piss off.

Stick to the issues and spare us your hatred of the East.

Everytime there is a discussion about Canadian politics, you always end up screaming about how them evil Easterners are attacking the west. You're constantly insulting Easterners. You're constantly blaming people from the East.

Enough already!

[notyoueither]

As i said, Tingkai, **** off.

Or, if you choose not to selectively ignore anything that does not play on your list. Try addressing the point. The Prime Minister of Canada running a campaign based on slander, and singeling out a single province as whipping boy for the pivitol issue.

Honestly? I don't think you have the grey matter to have an honest discussion on this, or anything else of any importance. You ignore the crux of a post and pick in on the opposite of what was said on other points. Like asking where Martin said 'barbarians' after I said, TWICE, that it wasn't Martin who said that.

yes, I agree. Enough.

[Tingkai]

Let's stick to the issues.

Looks like the election ain't over yet.

Two recounts could determine whether the Libs need the BQ. From the Globe:

"The key contest is in the British Columbia riding of New Westminster-Coquitlam. Incumbent Conservative MP Paul Forseth edged out NDP candidate Steve McClurg by 45 votes. The margin of victory is so narrow that a judicial recount is automatic.

If the recount reverses the result, the NDP would have the 20 seats required to give the Liberals a majority in the House, if it chooses.
...
In the riding of Edmonton-Beaumont, Liberal incumbent David Kilgour won by 32 votes, beating Conservative Tim Uppal.

At least 11 other ridings have the top two contenders within one percentage point of each other, preliminary figures from Elections Canada show. While recounts aren't automatic in most of these cases, candidates can try to persuade a judge that they have a good reason to request one.

[LulThyme]

Well obviously this wont be a very stable government, its a very interesting situation where every seats count, which makes for individual deputees very important...

[Flinx]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
They need one more seat, and the help of Duceppe to form government.
That independent will side with the Conservatives since his riding is in the Fraser Valley.
I think we will be voting very soon, perhaps as soon as the fall, since I do not see how Martin is going to cobble together a working minority.

1) The Conservative party needs to have a policy convention before it will fight another election.

2) The Bloc will never have it so good again.

3) Soft NDP supporters voted Liberal to prevent a conservative winning and ended up with a conservative in several ridings. The NDP needs to continue to improve its image and shore up support.

4) Paul Martin needs to have the public commission into the sponsorship scandal exonerate him.

5) Except in Alberta, everyone is happy to live with the result for quite a while. Whichever party causes a premature election any time soon, is going to tank in the polls.

6) The Liberals and Conservatives can agree on common policy on defence and border security etc., the Liberals, NDP and Bloc can agree on common policy like childcare, homecare, pharmacare, gay marriage, legal pot, etc. etc.

The Liberals should find it rather easy to cobble together a majority coalition on an issue by issue basis if they are not too arrogant. While Liberals are indeed often arrogant, they are usually pragmatic most of all; we will see which side wins.

[Flinx]

Originally posted by notyoueither
Incidentally, I should point out that trying to convince the average Albertan to change his or her poitical beliefs is about as productive as trying to convince Ben to be an atheist, or someone from Ontario or Quebec that a PM from the West could be a good thing.

Something happens, it pisses them off, they change courses and get entrenched there. They move trenches again when something else pisses them off.

Klein just pissed them off, royally.

People in Ontario and Quebec have nothing against people from the West. Anne McLellean or Ujjal Dosanjh would probably be quite acceptable Liberal PMs. It is the anti-collectivist, sink or swim, make-it-on-your-own, and don’t-help-your-neighbour ideas that do not come across very well out here. We do not believe in hand-outs but we do believe in a helping hand-up.

There is some speculation out here that Ralf Klein deliberately sabotaged the Conservative campaign because with Harper and the Conservatives in Ottawa, he would no longer have a bogeyman in Ottawa to vilify.

[notyoueither]

From what you say, Flinx, you'd think that there were no public education or other social programs between Winnipeg and the Rockies. I know that's not what you're saying, but it's stuff like that that grates on a great many nerves around here. When the Prime Minister gets up and wins an election on stuff like it, people get really pissed off.

re Klein, there is a lot of speculation out here that he did just that. Nobody is saying clearly why, but they're wondering. Myself, I thought at the time, and said it, that he along with Tories like Clark didn't think that the Conservatives were ready to form a government. If that is what Klein was thinking, I kind of agree with him. But people are still pissed off.

[Kontiki]

I don't want to get in the middle of this particular pissing contest, but I would like to reiterate that Alberta != the west. Alberta and Saskatchewan are the only provinces where the Conservatives got more than 40% of the popular vote. In Saskatchewan's case, it was just barely over at 41.6%. In Alberta, it was 61.6%.

[Flinx]

Sigh

:

I am going to go to the cottage and sit on the dock for 4 days

[notyoueither]

Well enough of that tack. Krazy and I traded posts. I intended to inform about what many people here think. I did not intend to be a thread killer.

Next topic. The lid is off the can of worms. Klein is saying that Albertans will be consulted on changes to healthcare, the province will then move forward, and if Martin really doesn't like it, Alberta may withdraw/opt out from the Canada Health Act. I'm not even sure if he/we can do that, but the topic of not getting much from Ottawa on this front has been discussed here before.

Thinking about it, Martin proposes to increase funding to 25%. How exactly does paying for 1 quarter of the tab empower the Feds to name the tune, direct the chorus, and control seating? I'm just asking.

Healthcare is a massive problem facing all provinces. Something has to change. What is at stake is how, 'cause it's gonna have to change.

[KrazyHorse]

Krazy and I traded posts

? I thought it was you and Tingkai fighting, not you and me...

[notyoueither]

Correct, but the topic is something that not many want to talk about, apparently. There seems to be a wall that I am prepared to wait for another day to chip at.

[KrazyHorse]

I'm confused.

[notyoueither]

In the mean time, no doubt Ralph didn't want to float this boat during the campaign. He's a cagey one, so he had to have some reason for dropping the bomb then.

I think it might have been to create the furour to start with. Now he is going to direct it. Flinx was right, in a way. And so was Harper. The fire is burning, and Klein wants to use it to wall off Alberta if that is needed to get Ottawa out of the provinces coffers.

That is my first take on it.