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  • #61
    Why the hell didn't you bring this up in 1861 ?
    I wasn't alive?

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    • #62
      A military intelligence analyst who recently completed duty at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq (news - web sites) said Wednesday that the 16-year-old son of a detainee there was abused by U.S. soldiers to break his father's resistance to interrogators.
      Saddam would have had the kid thrown out of a helicopter, so we can still say we're better than Saddam.

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      • #63
        If that's the best you have, I guess it will have to do.
        Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
        "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
        He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

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        • #64
          I believe you're confusing Saddam with Fez. But we can still say that we're better than Fez.
          "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
          -Bokonon

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          • #65
            Originally posted by Berzerker
            Kucinich, justifying or dismissing torture by pointing to murder is an example of moral relativism.
            No it isn't, not at all.

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            • #66
              At least, not compared to . . .

              Oh, never mind.

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              • #67
                If that's the best you have, I guess it will have to do.

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                • #68
                  No it isn't, not at all.
                  Then what is moral relativism?

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                  • #69
                    The idea that there is no objective morality.

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                    • #70
                      It's the idea that there is no objective morality.
                      "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                      -Bokonon

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                      • #71

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                        • #72
                          I should've gone with my second instincts and said:
                          It's the idea that morality is subjective.
                          "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                          -Bokonon

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                          • #73
                            The idea that there is no objective morality.
                            Which means morality is subjective and that's why justifying or dismissing torture by pointing to murder is moral relativism, i.e., morality is subjective and relative to the eye of the beholder with no objective - standardised or principled - morality that applies to everyone. Moral relativism allows for condemning murder when committed by the other side while dismissing torture committed by our side, true?

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                            • #74
                              Condemning the other side for doing things you do too isn't relativism, it's hypocrisy.

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                              • #75
                                But does moral relativism allow for hypocrisy? If morality is relative, then it depends on the changing whims of those making judgements, i.e., no principle need apply.
                                Whatever standard I apply to you need not apply to me because morality is relative, not objective. Objectivity requires that the standard I apply to you also apply to me...

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