And then God said "April Fool!"

[Kuciwalker]

I was talking about Abraham specifically.

Obviously, actual "christians" today don't believe it is right, but my point is that their morality does not, in fact, originate in the Bible.

Religion is almost always used as a justification for already-held social and moral values.

[MrFun]

Of course - I think I can agree with the obvious fact that when the dozens of different authors of different parts of the Bible wrote the passages, they were writing them based on already-held sense of morality.

[gamenaught]

Maybe God was conducting a sting operation and sent Abraham to hell for agreeing to sacrifice his son.

[Kuciwalker]

No, I mean christians today. It's rather simple to prove, actually - the fact that people can use the same document, the bible, to argue diametrically opposed positions on issues like gay marriage or abortion shows that virtually no one gets what they think is right or wrong from the bible. Instead, the simply justify what they ALREADY thought was right or wrong with the bible.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by gamenaught
Maybe God was conducting a sting operation and sent Abraham to hell for agreeing to sacrifice his son.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Kucinich
No, I mean christians today. It's rather simple to prove, actually - the fact that people can use the same document, the bible, to argue diametrically opposed positions on issues like gay marriage or abortion shows that virtually no one gets what they think is right or wrong from the bible. Instead, the simply justify what they ALREADY thought was right or wrong with the bible.

Yeah, that does make sense -- hence, my alienation from Catholicism (religion of my family). And hence, my desire to find an Episcopalian congregation in which I can take an active part in with complete acceptance of part of what I am.

[Kuciwalker]

But the consequence of that is that you're only "Christian" because you see affirmation of your beliefs in the Bible, when in fact any such affirmation is due to (at best) selective reading.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Kucinich
No, I mean christians today. It's rather simple to prove, actually - the fact that people can use the same document, the bible, to argue diametrically opposed positions on issues like gay marriage or abortion shows that virtually no one gets what they think is right or wrong from the bible. Instead, the simply justify what they ALREADY thought was right or wrong with the bible.

The Bible is progressive though, written over a period of many centuries, evolving as a document. Christ stated that he was the last great sacrifice for humanity's sake and that there would never be another required, so any one who believes that God requires them to sacrifice her children is contravening Christ's teachings.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Kucinich
But the consequence of that is that you're only "Christian" because you see affirmation of your beliefs in the Bible, when in fact any such affirmation is due to (at best) selective reading.

I never did take the Bible in literal terms. Otherwise, I would be a fundie now, wouldn't I?

[Kuciwalker]

But what if God sent another prophet, and yet again changed what was "right"? Say, now God thought that heterosexual sex was a sin?

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by MrFun
I never did take the Bible in literal terms. Otherwise, I would be a fundie now, wouldn't I?

And, in not taking the Bible in "literal terms", you really aren't a Christian.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Kucinich
But what if God sent another prophet, and yet again changed what was "right"? Say, now God thought that heterosexual sex was a sin?

The prophet would then be calling Christ a liar, which would obviously preclude his being considered a Christian and would therefore be dutefully ignored by all real Christians.

[Kuciwalker]

Was Jesus calling all the other prophets liars? No - he basically said "God changed his mind". Why couldn't God do so again?

EDIT: oh, and one of the premises was that the prophet was sent by GOD.

[gamenaught]

If I was a religioni...er..believer and a voice in my head said sacrifice my son, I'd assume it was Satan pretending to be God.

On the other hand, Satan would have to be really stupid to believe humans would believe that God would order someone to kill their own child.

Oh, wait..

[SpencerH]

Originally posted by MrFun


Thanks, Spencer -- so God commanded Abraham to stop the planned sacrifice of his son. Thus, God would condemn anyone who would kill their own children and in turn, means that it IS immoral to kill your own children, even if you thought God was telling you to do this.

If you believe God is telling you to kill your own child, then read this Biblical passage, and you will find yourself acting against God.

Good Lord!

You read that exerpt from genesis and came up with that interpretation!

I foresee a great future for you in (liberal) politics.