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Bonds cheated. Strip him of home run record?

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  • Bonds cheated. Strip him of home run record?

    Bonds (and perhaps Sosa and McGuire as well) cheated by taking steroids in setting their home run records. Should we strip them of their home run records?

    Selig seem strangely unconcerned about how this kind of gross misbehavior may forever taint baseball unless baseball does something about the home run records.



    "San Francisco Giants slugger Barry Bonds, New York Yankees stars Jason Giambi and Gary Sheffield and three other major league baseball players received steroids from a Burlingame nutritional supplement lab, federal investigators were told.

    The baseball stars allegedly got the illegal performance-enhancing drugs from the Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative through Greg Anderson, Bonds' personal weight trainer and longtime friend, according to information furnished the government and shared with The Chronicle.

    In addition to Bonds, Giambi and Sheffield, the other baseball players said to have received steroids from BALCO via Anderson were two former Giants, outfielder Marvin Benard and catcher Benito Santiago, and a former A's second baseman, Randy Velarde.

    Oakland Raiders linebacker Bill Romanowski also was said to have received performance-enhancing drugs.

    Anderson allegedly obtained a so-called designer steroid known as "the clear" and a testosterone-based steroid known as "the cream" from BALCO and supplied the substances to all six baseball players, the government was told. In addition, Bonds was said to have received human growth hormone, a powerful substance that legally cannot be distributed without a prescription, investigators were told.

    Agents obtained the information about the baseball players and illegal drugs last September during a probe that resulted in the indictment of Anderson, BALCO owner Victor Conte and two other Bay Area men on steroid conspiracy charges.

    The information shared with The Chronicle did not explicitly state that the athletes had used the drugs they were said to have obtained. Bonds, who is baseball's single-season home-run king, and Giambi, who won the American League Most Valuable Player award when he was with the Oakland Athletics, have publicly denied using steroids. So has Sheffield. All three declined to discuss the matter Monday.

    ....

    Ashcroft vowed to crack down on steroid abuse, saying it threatens the integrity of sports and "fosters a destructive culture contrary to the values that make sports such an important part of American life."

    But even as it promised to get tough on steroids, the government took unusual steps to turn the focus away from the elite athletes suspected of using the illegal substances that BALCO allegedly supplied. Early on, the government said it was not interested in prosecuting athletes for using steroids, instead granting them immunity when they were called to testify before the grand jury.

    The government also has deleted from public court files the names of every athlete who allegedly obtained illegal performance-enhancing drugs from BALCO."

    ....

    "Contacted for comment Monday, Baseball Commissioner Bud Selig called steroids "sinister and seductive" and said he was distressed about the allegations about the players.

    'We at Major League Baseball must strive for zero tolerance as it relates to the use of steroids and other performance-enhancing drugs,' Selig said in a statement. 'We will do everything in our power to get to zero tolerance as soon as possible.'"
    http://tools.wikimedia.de/~gmaxwell/jorbis/JOrbisPlayer.php?path=John+Williams+The+Imperial+M arch+from+The+Empire+Strikes+Back.ogg&wiki=en

  • #2
    Re: Bonds cheated. Strip him of home run record?

    Originally posted by Ned
    "Contacted for comment Monday, Baseball Commissioner Bud Selig called steroids "sinister and seductive" and said he was distressed about the allegations about the players.

    'We at Major League Baseball must strive for zero tolerance as it relates to the use of steroids and other performance-enhancing drugs,' Selig said in a statement. 'We will do everything in our power to get to zero tolerance as soon as possible.'"
    Cheated... up until this year it wasn't against baseball rules... so how can you call it cheating

    I love his "as soon as possible" line... they've ignored it for years because the fans love the home runs.
    Keep on Civin'
    RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Re: Bonds cheated. Strip him of home run record?

      Originally posted by Ming
      Cheated... up until this year it wasn't against baseball rules... so how can you call it cheating
      If that's the case, then any such conduct before the rule was enacted shouldn't be taken into account, I suppose.

      Then again, obtaining the drugs sans prescription was still quite illegal even before the rule, so should that fact have any bearing on their disposition?
      Tutto nel mondo è burla

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      • #4
        While they could be arrested... it still wasn't against baseball rules... go figure
        Keep on Civin'
        RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

        Comment


        • #5
          Yes, but IIRC many sports organizations will punish illegal behavior, even if it isn't specifically against their rules.
          Tutto nel mondo è burla

          Comment


          • #6
            Sadly, I think Ming's correct. McGuire was taking something that he admitted. It was a pre-steroid that you can buy legitimately in many nuitritional supplement stores (like GNC). The body converts it to testosterone. It's a technical way of getting around not being able to get steroids, make your body produce more of them.
            Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

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            • #7
              The problem is... Baseball has been "turning a blind eye" to the problem for years... Even their current new testing rules show what a farce Selig's zero tolerence comments are.
              Keep on Civin'
              RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

              Comment


              • #8
                The MLBPA treats the steroid issue as a bargaining chip. Given their power, and the interest the owners/commish have in keeping the status quo (the aforementioned love of home runs), I doubt any real change will come of this.

                -Arrian
                grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

                The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

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                • #9
                  Bring back the *
                  Best MMORPG on the net: www.cyberdunk.com?ref=310845

                  An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind. -Gandhi

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    At least he wasn't corking his bat
                    Monkey!!!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yep... which is funny. corking the bat is and was against baseball rules. Yet even the best experts say it really doesn't help all that much. Yet steriods weren't illegal, and they can make A BIG DIFFERENCE. Go figure
                      Keep on Civin'
                      RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        up until this year it wasn't against baseball rules


                        Yep, that's the point. If it wasn't against the rules, then he couldn't have cheated, and nothing is being stripped.

                        Everyone laughs at Jeff Kent for saying Ruth and Gehrig may have been taking something. THEY WERE! It was steroids (like Kent said), but they were taking drugs to help their performance.
                        “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                        - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Ming
                          Yep... which is funny. corking the bat is and was against baseball rules. Yet even the best experts say it really doesn't help all that much. Yet steriods weren't illegal, and they can make A BIG DIFFERENCE. Go figure
                          I'm not so sure that steroids make that big a difference. It doesn't matter how powerfully you swing the bat if you can't connect. Steriods and football is another story.
                          “It is no use trying to 'see through' first principles. If you see through everything, then everything is transparent. But a wholly transparent world is an invisible world. To 'see through' all things is the same as not to see.”

                          ― C.S. Lewis, The Abolition of Man

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                          • #14
                            Indeed... hitting the ball squarely is the hardest thing to do in baseball. Steroids will help the ball go farther, true... but you still have to be able to hit. It ain't like Bonds wasn't an All-Star and MVP winner when he didn't look steroid-bulked.
                            “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                            - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Yes... you still have to hit the ball... but the extra distance is the difference between an easy fly out and a home run
                              Keep on Civin'
                              RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

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