Israeli vandalises Swedish suicide bomber art

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Ned
Here is Oliver Wendell Holmes in Schenk v. U.S. on the borderline case:

"But the character of every act depends upon the circumstances in which it is done. Aikens v. Wisconsin, 195 U.S. 194, 205, 206. The most stringent protection of free speech would not protect a man in falsely shouting fire in a theatre and causing a panic. It does not even protect a man from an injunction against uttering words that may have all the effect of force. Gompers v. Bucks Stove & Range Co., 221 U.S. 418, 439. The question in every case is whether the words used are used in such circumstances and are of such a nature as to create a clear and present danger that they will bring about the substantive evils that Congress has a right to prevent. It is a question of proximity and degree. "

http://www.tourolaw.edu/patch/Schenck/

That was about anti-war speech. The case upheld the Congresses righ to prevent citizens from speaking out against war. Not one of their finer moments.

[Datajack Franit]

You all please don't call art what I could have done by myself, art died about 60 years ago and was replaced by obscenities that cover the complete lack of any trace of talent

[Edan]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


I don't get this part. Where do you come up with this? I looked at this piece and I thought, that woman is evil.

I read the caption that described her as a poor child about to be devoured by wild beasts.

[Combat Ingrid]

No, that's the story about Snow White. The story about the bomber tells very clearly that she murdered lots of people.

[Edan]

Originally posted by Combat Ingrid
No, that's the story about Snow White. The story about the bomber tells very clearly that she murdered lots of people.

It's the story of Snow White included within the story of the bomber.

[Cruddy]

Does this mean the Israeli Ambassador is really a Philestine?

Makes his position on vandalism look very suspect - in short, he's asking for a kicking.

:kick:

Was he baptised a diplomat or has he got a rich Daddy?

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Edan


I read the caption that described her as about to be devoured by wild beasts.

And she was, wasn't she?

She blew herself up in a crowd of people.

[Al'Kimiya]

The topic is not the art thing at all. It's the pro-Arab mindset of the Swedes (and Europeans in general) that pisses off the Israelis. It goes not one day without reading the one-sided bias (hatred) in the media, which forms the public opinion. Sure, this will only enflame further. Only one thing is certain, the war has just begun.

[Cruddy]

Originally posted by Al'Kimiya
The topic is not the art thing at all. It's the pro-Arab mindset of the Swedes (and Europeans in general) that pisses off the Israelis.

Nah. What pisses them off is we don't back Israel.

We don't back the Arabs either - if we did, Israel would really have a war on their hands. I don't think this is the way forward though.

[Edan]

Originally posted by Agathon


In this case the artists were clear that the work was not meant to glorify suicide bombings

It wasn't anything of the sort - otherwise we wouldn't have a 9-page thread debating it, would we?

[Edan]

Originally posted by Osweld


And she was, wasn't she?

She blew herself up in a crowd of people.

So twenty one innocent people in a restuant eating their meals are a bunch of wild beasts trying to devour her?

I can't believe you wrote that.

[GePap]

What offends people here is the merest mention that there might have been a reason for what this woman did- this is why they scream that this is gloryfication: becuase we are to see her as sme animal-or better yet, some evil spirit. Perhaps showing her image is some incantation that rbings her evil back or whatever..

all of which is childish bull, but oh so human...

This woman did what she did for a reason, but what she did was a horrible and despicable crime. And the fact that this happened, the fact this woman, with her seemingly promising life, average life, middle class life went and did what she did is what astounds: what chalenges the "truth" we have built for ourselves, that "our" kind of people, fr she is our kind of people, did something we think simply can not be associated with us.

NO, this art does NOT glorify what she did..it very clearly states what she did was a crime to abhor- but it insults some here for not making her a charicature of evil (in fact, undermining this image by using a charicature of purity) but perhaps, all too human.

and Al'Kimiya is party correct- this is about the growing sense in Israel, actively fed by the government, that everyne hate the Jews, us v. the world, blah, blah blah. Well, thank god for Israel that is not true, for otherwise there would be no Israel.

[Ned]

Does anyone have a link to the Israeli admission that the action of the Ambassador was planned? My posts were premised on the notion that he reacted viscerally to the exhibit.

[Traianvs]

Originally posted by Al'Kimiya
The topic is not the art thing at all. It's the pro-Arab mindset of the Swedes (and Europeans in general) that pisses off the Israelis. It goes not one day without reading the one-sided bias (hatred) in the media, which forms the public opinion. Sure, this will only enflame further. Only one thing is certain, the war has just begun.

Yet at the same time many arabs find the Europeans are racist towards arabs (at least against the arabs that live in European countries).

I just find it funny that the Israeli government, backing up their ambassador can decide what art can and cannot be shown in other countries. What on earth are they thinking!

Not the first, and last (I'm afraid) blunder the Israeli government is making in these troublesome times!

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Edan

It wasn't anything of the sort - otherwise we wouldn't have a 9-page thread debating it, would we?

We are only having a nine page thread because some people either haven't read the artists' own explanation of what the piece is about or don't believe them (despite having no good reason not to).

There really isn't any debate any more, people who say the piece glorifies suicide bombers just aren't listening to the artists.