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From all I've read Clinton didn't do anything about homeland security, except said we should do A, B, C.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
Clinton didn't do anything. I'm sure he understood the threat. But his hands were tied. He couldn't take away liberties by increasing homeland security- that would be deemed as targetting middle eastern nationalities- not something the democractic party would approve of. And he couldn't risk military action (Somalia taught him a lessong there).
If Clinton did do something domestically, there's a good chance 9/11 wouldn't have happened.
I'm not going to say Bush did anything either. Because he didn't. Neither president seemed to realize how significant attack could happen on U.S. soil. Or if they did realize that an attack could occur, neither one could do anything because of the inevitable political backlash from their own parties.
The bottom line is that the President is doing more than any other to battle these radicals, he's not sticking his finger in the air to see if bold military action against these a**holes is popular.
He knows what he has to do.
And if his efforts aren't enough, then I will find criticism, but I can't believe anyone can't realize that the President has initiated bolder moves in this effort than anyone past, and that the democratic party (mostly) is using whatever they can to win an election rather than support their country.
While there might be a physics engine that applies to the jugs, I doubt that an entire engine was written specifically for the funbags. - Cyclotron - debating the pressing issue of boobies in games.
Neither president seemed to realize how significant attack could happen on U.S. soil. Or if they did realize that an attack could occur, neither one could do anything because of the inevitable political backlash from their own parties.
I agree with this statement. My point was that even though Clinton recognized the threat (somewhat) there was little he or Bush could have done politically. Making a Homeland Security department costs money, and that would not have been approved without a crisis.
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
Originally posted by vee4473
The bottom line is that the President is doing more than any other to battle these radicals, he's not sticking his finger in the air to see if bold military action against these a**holes is popular.
No, he's giving the illusion that he's doing more. He has lobbied against attempts to make the transportation industry liable for security failures. He has lobbied against mandatory cargo inspection on aircraft and in our nation's ports. He goes on TV and gives these ignorant speeches about "evil-doers" and has America duped into thinking Saddam Hussein was a threat and responsible for 9-11. And what about Afghanistan? The president has completely turned his back on getting Osama. Don't you think the 150k troops in Iraq would be more useful in the tribal regions around the Afghan-Paki border where Osama probably is? But no... he's using America's military to fight his own personal vendetta against Saddam.
He knows what he has to do.
I agree. The president knows what he has to do. But he's choosing not to do it. He's not securing our country, he's not fighting terrorists. And he's exploiting 9-11 and the issue of terrorism in order to execute his agenda (that was planned way before he even took office).
And if his efforts aren't enough, then I will find criticism, but I can't believe anyone can't realize that the President has initiated bolder moves in this effort than anyone past, and that the democratic party (mostly) is using whatever they can to win an election rather than support their country.
Clinton did more to fight terror than Bush. Search the net and investigate for yourself. Clinton initiated more counter-terrorism funding than any other president in history (including Dubya). Clinton had counter-terror experts create plans (Department of Homeland security authored by Clinton people). Clinton had plans to go after Al Qaeda... in fact, Gore was going to lead the charge in 2000. And when Gore won the election and Bush took power, Clinton briefed Condi Rice and the Bush people about what they should do and Dubya ignored EVERYTHING.
You ***** and moan about how the Dem's are trying to use this for political advantage. BUT NOT ONE DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE IS TALKING ABOUT BUSH'S NATIONAL SECURITY FAILURES. Sure, I think Dean maybe said something about Bush's connection to the bin Ladens... but he hasn't talked a lot about it. Maybe Kucinich has said something, but he's a lefty kook.
The fact is, Bush is a danger to this country. I don't know if he truly believe the terrorists hate us because of our "freedoms". If he does, it speaks volumes about his ignorance and stupidity. Remember, before the 2000 election, Bush had never even been OUT OF THE COUNTRY. He didn't know hardly any foreign leaders' names. He had no military experience (unless you count being AWOL from the national guard from 72-73 as experience)... and he ignored the previous administration's warnings about terrorism.
Imran seems to be the only one who really gets it. Clinton couldn't do much of anything, what with the right wasting millions of taxpayer dollars and law enforcement resources investigating a damn stain on a dress and a blowjob.
Imran seems to be the only one who really gets it. Clinton couldn't do much of anything, what with the right wasting millions of taxpayer dollars and law enforcement resources investigating a damn stain on a dress and a blowjob.
Say what? I also said Bush couldn't do anything with Democrats raising a stink about the cost and civil rights.
Don't try to turn my statements into an anti-right-wing circle jerk like you normally like .
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
I cannot debate a person that is as blinded by politcal hatred as you are.
You make statements that come from nowhere and have no substance.
A Sava quote :
"I agree. The president knows what he has to do. But he's choosing not to do it. He's not securing our country, he's not fighting terrorists. And he's exploiting 9-11 and the issue of terrorism in order to execute his agenda (that was planned way before he even took office). "
another:
"And when Gore won the election and Bush took power, ..."
Even if Bush won by only ONE vote, he won. Good Lord... Since when does winning by a few votes mean you didn't win..?
anyway
well, i will add you to the ignore list as your lefty rantings make me ill.
At least others who disagree with the President have real reasons, you just go on and on about, well....bs
While there might be a physics engine that applies to the jugs, I doubt that an entire engine was written specifically for the funbags. - Cyclotron - debating the pressing issue of boobies in games.
Let's talk about what's going on NOW and how we're going to solve it
We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution. - Abraham Lincoln
I cannot debate a person that is as blinded by politcal hatred as you are.
you mean someone who is informed?
You make statements that come from nowhere and have no substance.
wow you can't debate what I say so you attack me...
A Sava quote :
"I agree. The president knows what he has to do. But he's choosing not to do it. He's not securing our country, he's not fighting terrorists. And he's exploiting 9-11 and the issue of terrorism in order to execute his agenda (that was planned way before he even took office). "
another:
"And when Gore won the election and Bush took power, ..."
Even if Bush won by only ONE vote, he won. Good Lord... Since when does winning by a few votes mean you didn't win..?
Do I need to post the popular vote records from the 2000 election? Bush lost by about 500k... and a complete recount in Florida after the fact revealed he lost Florida, too. When you buy off a few Supreme Court justices, it's easy for them to stop the democratic process from proving you lost.
well, i will add you to the ignore list as your lefty rantings make me ill.
good, continue to live in your retarded little dream world... I'll pray for you.
At least others who disagree with the President have real reasons, you just go on and on about, well....bs
I think 3,000 deaths are real reasons... I think a useless war is a real reason... I think terrible domestic policies are real reasons. I'm sorry, but I'm sick and tired of my government lying to me. That's a real reason. I'm sick and tired of seeing the top marginal tax rate getting cut while state and local taxes rise on lower income families. I'm sick of wages remaining stagnant and consumer debt rising because health care and education costs keep rising because of federal cuts. Those are very real reasons to despise the Republican Party and their ****** chimpy president.
But if it makes you feel better, I didn't like Clinton that much. But I at least give him credit where credit is due. If you want to see me ***** about Clinton, I can create a thread. At least that will satisfy your dopey right wing beliefs.
Originally posted by Ted Striker
right, left, Clinton, Gore, shoulda, coulda, woulda
WHO GIVES A ****
I give a **** about when my government lies to me... I give a **** when my government is wasting my money... I give a **** when 3,000 people DIE because my president is too ignorant and too incompetent to lead this country.
Let's talk about what's going on NOW and how we're going to solve it
#1... elect a president that CARES about America and national security... and one who won't lie to the American people... maybe Dean or Clark... I'd even settle for a John McCain.
you're correct striker, but I cannot abide those that just attack the president with no acknowledgement of anything good he may have done , simply because they are of the opposite party.
As such, I think the president is doing what any responsible president would do.
Does anyone think that just initaitng programs and funding commitees is as effective as real military action in this case?
Whether the military actions the president is taking are the best ones or the most effective is moot because at least he has the balls to TAKE action in the name of security. Even if some think it is in the wrong direction.
He's not sitting around and debating in committee ad nauseum with the whole world (read UN) about how best to defend HIS country!!
If the rest of the world thinks it's just the US that these radical murderers want dead, they are in for a very rude awakening should the US ever actually be destroyed by these scumbags.
While there might be a physics engine that applies to the jugs, I doubt that an entire engine was written specifically for the funbags. - Cyclotron - debating the pressing issue of boobies in games.
We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution. - Abraham Lincoln
Originally posted by vee4473
you're correct striker, but I cannot abide those that just attack the president with no acknowledgement of anything good he may have done , simply because they are of the opposite party.
I'm not a Democrat. They are just the lesser of the two evils.
As such, I think the president is doing what any responsible president would do.
running up the largest spending deficits in history? taking unprovoked military action against foreign nations? or maybe it's alienating the entire world community?
Does anyone think that just initaitng programs and funding commitees is as effective as real military action in this case?
military action is effective... but only if you target THE PEOPLE RESPONSIBLE FOR ATTACKING US! And even then, attacking people on a foreign land doesn't protect us from the terrorists ALREADY IN OUR COUNTRY!
Whether the military actions the president is taking are the best ones or the most effective is moot because at least he has the balls to TAKE action in the name of security. Even if some think it is in the wrong direction.
because Clinton didn't attack anyone right? *coughHaitiSomaliaKosovoIraq*
He's not sitting around and debating in committee ad nauseum with the whole world (read UN) about how best to defend HIS country!!
you mean he's not building coalitions like his father?
If the rest of the world thinks it's just the US that these radical murderers want dead, they are in for a very rude awakening should the US ever actually be destroyed by these scumbags.
again, you are making the same damn ignorant mistake in thinking Iraq is somehow linked to the war on terror...
Originally posted by Ted Striker
I agree with you vee
They drew first blood!!!!
While there might be a physics engine that applies to the jugs, I doubt that an entire engine was written specifically for the funbags. - Cyclotron - debating the pressing issue of boobies in games.
Yes a U.S. ground campaign in Afghanistan would have been different. But of course the main difference between us and the Soviets is tremendous and accurate air power and bombardment. A luxery the Soviets did not have.
Killing 19 children to get one terrorist like what happened the other day constitutes 'tremendous and accurate airpower'?
Maybe the rather large familes in that part of the world was never a part of the equation.
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