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Global Warming Has Been Happening For A Long Time

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  • Global Warming Has Been Happening For A Long Time

    ...a very, very long time.

    It's a "good thing".

    'Prehistoric man began global warming'
    Date: December 11 2003


    Measurements of ancient air bubbles trapped in Antarctic ice offers evidence that humans have been changing the global climate since thousands of years before the industrial revolution.

    From 8000 years ago, atmospheric levels of carbon dioxide began to rise as humans started clearing forests, planting crops and raising livestock, a scientist said on Tuesday. Methane levels started increasing 3000 years later.

    The combined increases of the two greenhouse gases implicated in global warming were slow but steady and staved off what should have been a period of significant natural cooling, said Bill Ruddiman, emeritus professor at the University of Virginia.

    The changes also disrupted regular patterns that dominated the 400,000 years of atmospheric history that scientists have teased from samples of ancient ice.

    "You have 395,000 years of history, which sets some rules, and 5000 years that break those rules," Professor Ruddiman said.

    He briefed reporters on his theory at the autumn meeting of the American Geophysical Union on Tuesday. Further details appear in the December issue of the journal Climatic Change.

    Previously, scientists assumed widely it was only with the onset of the factory age that human activity had any significant effect on the global climate. The prehistoric changes in carbon dioxide and methane levels have been noted before but were attributed to natural causes, Professor Ruddiman said.

    "It's a great new idea we need to talk about and evaluate," said Bette Otto-Bliesner, a paleoclimate expert at the National Centre for Atmospheric Research, who was not connected with the research.

    Atmospheric levels of carbon dioxide and methane naturally fluctuate, in part because of changes in the orbit of the Earth and the resulting variations in the amounts of sunlight.

    But human activity apparently thwarted expected decreases in the atmospheric concentrations of both gases.

    Leading the change was the revolutionary adoption, across both Europe and Asia, of agriculture and animal husbandry, Professor Ruddiman said.

    Analysis of air trapped in ice cores drilled from the Antarctic ice sheet show anomalous increases in carbon dioxide levels beginning 8000 years ago - just as crop lands began to replace previously forested regions across Asia and Europe.

    About 5000 years ago, the ice cores reflect a similarly anomalous rise in methane levels, this time tied to increased emissions from flooded rice fields, as well as burgeoning numbers of livestock, Professor Ruddiman said.

    The prehistoric practices apparently overrode a build-up of ice that models predict should have occurred from 5000 years ago.

    AP
    No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

  • #2
    I was just going to post this .

    basically humans=evil.

    except if you consider that global warming prevented the planet from getting too cold to support any sizable human population

    Comment


    • #3
      What's up? Just you and me? People only care if it's bad thing?
      No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

      Comment


      • #4
        Um, ok, but what happened 500 years ago during the little ice age? The Global Temp actually went down then.

        Comment


        • #5
          Hiccup.
          No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

          Comment


          • #6
            The more I learn about global warming/cooling, the more I feel that it's beyond our control at our current technological level. However, that doesn't mean we *shouldn't* try to cut down on pollutants and whatnot — it might buy us another 500 to 1,000 years ... time we might need to evolve into a technological super-civilization capable of exerting a great degree of environmental control on the world it occupies.

            Gatekeeper
            "I may not agree with what you have to say, but I'll die defending your right to say it." — Voltaire

            "Wheresoever you go, go with all your heart." — Confucius

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            • #7
              Not exactly news, this has been mentioned before. What I'd like to know is the level of difference projected between our current level of emissions, and what would have been w/o early human activity.
              I'm consitently stupid- Japher
              I think that opinion in the United States is decidedly different from the rest of the world because we have a free press -- by free, I mean a virgorously presented right wing point of view on the air and available to all.- Ned

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              • #8
                This is news IF the past 400,000 years reflected in the ice cores don't show similar rises in greenhouse gases during past interglacial periods.

                "You have 395,000 years of history, which sets some rules, and 5000 years that break those rules," Professor Ruddiman said.
                What does that mean exactly? Greenhouse gases increase during all interglacial periods, so have they increased more over the last 8,000 years than any other period?

                Comment


                • #9
                  No, what it's saying is that, at the point where past episodes indicated there should be a (pre-ice age) reduction in gases, this most recent period shows a continued increase.

                  In short, our evil, evil ways have saved our skinny butts from being encased in ice.
                  No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    No, what it's saying is that, at the point where past episodes indicated there should be a (pre-ice age) reduction in gases, this most recent period shows a continued increase.
                    These gases always increase during interglacial periods and these gases continue increasing until whatever causes a new ice advance gets triggered. I don't have my graphs handy but interglacial periods can last as little as ~6-7 thousand years up to ~15,000 years. It's been roughly 13-14 thousand years since the end of the last ice advance so I'm not concerned with "global warming" but with what will trigger the next advance of the ice sheets. I'm hoping human activity does help negate the trigger but I suspect the trigger is far beyond our control.

                    It has been said ice advances have several orbital phenomenon coming together to decrease summer sunlight to the higher (northern) latitudes resulting in less snow melt during the summer months which in turn results in more snow remaining on the ground heading into winter.

                    The orbital tilt of the Earth is one of these phenomenon and the Earth's tilt is ~23.45 degrees now. The tilt varies cyclically between 24.5 degrees and 21.5 degrees with the latter number being more conducive to an ice advance and we are on the downswing of that cycle, i.e., we were at 24.5 a few thousand years ago and are heading for 21.5 degrees in maybe 3,000 years. If we are approaching the 21.5 number at the same time as the N Hemisphere is having it's summer while the Earth is at the furthest extreme in orbital eccentricity, then we have the makings of a new ice advance.

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                    • #11
                      The problem I have with global warming is twofold. One, prove to me it isn't part of a natural cycle. Two, prove that it's actually happening at all. The temperature at ground level is different than atmospheric. So one can go up and the other down or vice versa. The scientists who say gloabl warming is occurring are liars and so are those who refute it. Truth is no one knows and no one I've seen so far can prove one way or the other. When a meteorologist cannot get tomorrow's weather right and some clown tells me the temperature trend for the next hundred years I laugh at them. There is no statistical, empiracle evidence of global warming or cooling and that's that. As an engineer I couldn't depend on anything they say for any data at all. Talk to me in 500 years when they have a clue.
                      Pax Superiore Vi Tellarum
                      Equal Opportunity Killer: We will kill regardless of race, creed, color,
                      gender, sexual preference,or age

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                      • #12
                        even if it is a natural cycle there is reason to prevent global warming. Mainly the loss of habitable land, disruption of ecosystems, flooded cities, more natural disasters, increase in disease etc.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by cia
                          One, prove to me it isn't part of a natural cycle. Two, prove that it's actually happening at all.
                          1. This is easy. There's no known natural source that can release greenhouse gases like humans can.

                          2. Looks like that is beyond dispute.
                          (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
                          (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
                          (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

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                          • #14
                            Urban Ranger, I listened for three painful hours how a UN scientist told me how the surface temperature of the Earth is rising while the temperature planetwide at 10000 feet is falling and the oceans fluctuate too much to gain consistant reading. Look at the average CO and CO2 expulsions from a small volcanic explosion and measure it against the yearly output of the human activity the scientists peg on humans. It's a rat's pituitary gland of difference if the volcanio is not larger. It is in my mind human hubris that we can change the Earth's ecosystem at will. It's like saying enough pesticide can kill all the cockroaches in any major city. I would bet you a million to one against it.
                            Pax Superiore Vi Tellarum
                            Equal Opportunity Killer: We will kill regardless of race, creed, color,
                            gender, sexual preference,or age

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Harry Tuttle
                              Um, ok, but what happened 500 years ago during the little ice age? The Global Temp actually went down then.
                              The Black Death - so many died that we didn't plant and harvest for a year?
                              http://tools.wikimedia.de/~gmaxwell/jorbis/JOrbisPlayer.php?path=John+Williams+The+Imperial+M arch+from+The+Empire+Strikes+Back.ogg&wiki=en

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