"Bowling for Columbine" critics and naysayers answered...

[Ming]

Gee... I don't think anybody is arguing that bombers don't kill people... hell, we were at war.

But there is a big difference in what he implies the plaque says... The plague is dedicated to the military personal who simply did their job and fought the war. As usual, he doesn't get it right, and takes things out of context. For every war memorial for our troops, one can assume that people on the other side died as well... and their purpose isn't to gloat over the fact that others were killed...

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


I dunno. Let us run the U.S. for a while and we'll see. You can have it back if it doesn't work out.

No thanks, we already saw what you did to those other countries we let you have.

[Sava]

The plague is dedicated to the military personal who simply did their job and fought the war.

[Sava]

Larry Horse says Ming is to diseasy...

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Ming
For every war memorial for our troops, one can assume that people on the other side died as well... and their purpose isn't to gloat over the fact that others were killed...

It's one thing to memorialize a job well done. It's another to memorialize a war crime, which the Christmas Eve bombings were. It's be like having a statue for a soldier who shot a VC saving his fellow soldiers while they were busy slaughtering My Lai.

[Ming]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
It's one thing to memorialize a job well done. It's another to memorialize a war crime, which the Christmas Eve bombings were. It's be like having a statue for a soldier who shot a VC saving his fellow soldiers while they were busy slaughtering My Lai.

I guess you simply ignored the fact that it was for all the different crews that served on board the aircraft during it's 26 year history...

Your example is irrelevent... I'm sure there are people on the Viet Nam Memorial that probably participated in war crimes as well... but that doesn't invalidate the memorial or mean that it was built to honor war crimes.

[Sava]

You are right Ming... but you have to realize that when some people see a memorial of a B-52, they think more about the innocents that it killed rather than the people who flew them.

I don't necessarily have that kind of view of war memorials. I acknowledge they were made in good faith. But there are two sides to the coin.

[Spec]

Originally posted by Ming
Gee... I don't think anybody is arguing that bombers don't kill people... hell, we were at war.

But there is a big difference in what he implies the plaque says... The plague is dedicated to the military personal who simply did their job and fought the war. As usual, he doesn't get it right, and takes things out of context. For every war memorial for our troops, one can assume that people on the other side died as well... and their purpose isn't to gloat over the fact that others were killed...

WTH Ming!?

Where's your usual '''' in that post.



Spec.

[Ming]

And I think of all the enemy soldiers that the plane killed... and the brave people that flew the aircraft. You can abuse the leaders that picked the missions... But the plague isn't memorializing the leaders that sent the plane on "illegal missions"... it is memorializing the crews that flew it.

The plague is NOT a memorial to killing civilians.

That's all I'm saying.

[Sprayber]

Why is anyone sligthly interested in what MM says. There are far better people out there speaking out against guns and you people cling on to him.

[Ramo]

Plague again, Ming? Something in the back of your mind?

[Ming]

yeah... pretty funny... it's one of those good typos

[Whoha]

Yea, thats why every weapon in his arsenal is Soviet,french or Chinese, because we armed him.

The fact is, that US trade with saddam barely amounted to 1% of all trade done with him. Doesn't quite qualify "mostly built up by the Reagan, then Bush administration" does it.

Now for this site:

http://www.casi.org.uk/info/usdocs/usiraq80s90s.html#ten

Number 11:
":Later in the year the Reagan Administration secretly began to allow Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Egypt to transfer to Iraq U.S. howitzers, helicopters, bombs and other weapons.[11]"

http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/IRQ_IMPRTS_73-02.pdf

Eygpt:80 Training planes that are propeller driven
Jordan:2 Spirit S-76's, civilian craft that have to be modified.
Itally: 8 helicopters and 1 ship.
SA and Kuwait aren't even on the list of Places Iraq bought arms from.

Eygpt did sell them several soviet made weapons, thats pretty much it for the list. # 11 is wrong. In any event, the premise does not make sense, the US is the largest exporter of arms to the world, we would have sold them directly to him if we wanted to.

Number 37:
"U.S. intelligence reported in 1991 that the U.S. helicopters sold to Iraq in 1983 were used in 1988 to spray Kurds with chemicals.[37]"

I keep seeing this, and I keep seeing no proof of it, it sites an LA times article as a source. Lets see,30(not 10 as the piece states) Bell helicopters, or over 200 soviet helicopters... which one is more likely... and remember, our helicopters can be brought down by small arms fire, but the Hinds are quite impervious to that form of attack.

Number 38:
""Reagan administration records show that between September and December 1988, 65 licenses were granted for dual-use technology exports. This averages out as an annual rate of 260 licenses, more than double the rate for January through August 1988."[38]"

Only 15 licenses ever sent anything to Iraq, http://161.203.16.4/t2pbat4/150766.pdf, so this is a very misleading quote.

As for non-conventional weapons, Iraq had chemical and Bio warfare capabilities as early as 1980, well before we ever met with him,unless one of the 15 licenses was a Time machine, the allegation that we helped Saddam develop this Capability is Absurd. The Europeans and others were keeping him well equipped in that regards.
The House Banking & Finance committee shows that we sold Iraq biological research materials, not 500 tons of thiodiglycol like the Belgians:

http://cbw.sipri.se/cbw/002050100.html

Finally, to round everything out, the picture MM shows in that quote, is of a bunch of soviet tanks.

[KrazyHorse]

test. ****

[KrazyHorse]

double test. *** fags ****** ******s