Greece court convicts November 17 mastermind, 14 others

[Bereta_Eder]

I didn't use to praise them unless you're talking about either trolling or (most propably) your own ineptitude to understand what's being said.


Also you again got it wrong. I'm not defending 17N, I'm explaining the things you say make an "impression" to you.

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
You know when I saw you were trolling I never thought you'd be telling the truth.

If 23 people dead in 30 years is a terrorist heaven, I wonder what 2,500 or so dead in a couple of hours is.

[DinoDoc]

Who said I was talking about 17N?

[Bereta_Eder]

Who said you did?

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by paiktis22

point me out one.

Yeah, like I am going to dig through the archives for that.

There are countless people who can confirm you wrote about 17N being special, "not just like any other terrorist group" etc etc.

Anyway, as I said I am not judging. You can support who you want

I live in a country not unlike yours, with high nationalism, sharp left-right divisions going back to second world war and so on.

But one should at least have the courage to face the facts and admit the truth.

Which is what you are not doing, I am not sure you realize but you and MarkG both are acting like propagandists.

Examples? Read this thread.

MarkG says only 23 dead in 30 years, hardly worth mention...

CIA -almost- puts you on a "bad country list" and you say it is "childish overblowing out of proportion"

[Bereta_Eder]

Give up the trolling

Yes they had acute difference with most other terrorist groups. Sorry if you can't see it. How's this supporting them?

Also Croatia is leagues away from Greece. I hope sometime you catch on but don't fool yourself thinking we're the same.


Also propagandists? For simply stating the obvious?

[VetLegion]

I was talking about.. how should I say.. intellectual integrity? If you have two clear facts, add them up and draw a conclusion. It won't always be pleasant but you owe it to yourself.

And self-delusion, also a crime against reason.

If BBC says 17N used to have silent popular support, and you say it had not, while having written positively about them yourself, who should I trust?

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by VetLegion
Examples? Read this thread.

MarkG says only 23 dead in 30 years, hardly worth mention...

I think what he said is that this hardly equates a country into being a terrorist heaven. With the same logic US is the world's best terrorist paradise.

So obviously it doesn't really hold water. Get it?

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by VetLegion
I was talking about.. how should I say.. intellectual integrity? If you have two clear facts, add them up and draw a conclusion. It won't always be pleasant you owe it to yourself.

And self-delusion, also a crime against reason.

If BBC says 17N used to have silent popular support, and you say it had not, while having written positively about them yourself, who should I trust?

Point me out exactly where BBC says that.


Indifference and that up to a certain timeframe would be more like it. And I already explained the reasons. Allow me to know my own country a bit better than you.

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by paiktis22

I think what he said is that this hardly equates a country into being a terrorist heaven. With the same logic US is the world's best terrorist paradise.

And I bet CIA were not that mean either. How many secrets in Greece get kept for 30 years? I can see why it seemed to them like serious government tolerance and thus - "terrorist heaven"

Almost

Anyway you have trolled me into a discussion I had no intention of participating in but fine, we exchanged a few good points, made a few things clearer and that's it. I'm leaving this thread to other discussants. Cheers

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by VetLegion


And I bet CIA were not that mean either. How many secrets in Greece get kept for 30 years? I can see why it seemed to them like serious government tolerance and thus - "terrorist heaven"

More conspiracy theories
Perhaps you should see all the relevent legislation to tackle with this problem since 1970's onward. Perhaps the extreme confidentiality of 17N which was unparalleled in any other terrorist organization in Europe coupled with poor policework and youd arrive to conclusions without feeding your paranoia?

As for the US I sincerely hope they've wised up since because they have some real threats to tackle with for a change now.

Anyway you have trolled me into a discussion I had no intention of participating in but fine, we exchanged a few good points, made a few things clearer and that's it. I'm leaving this thread to other discussants. Cheers

Bye I simply wish you had condemned your own fascistoid gov. as well. Like the european press has done.

[VetLegion]

Bye

Well, you are known to call the mods when things are not going your way so I am getting out while still in the clear

Btw, for the BBC, I quoted that on the first page but admit it, this is a strawman since you know perfectly well 17N was not really considered a danger in Greece, as you have already said. You are contradicting yourself

[Bereta_Eder]

Point me out exactly where BBC says that 17N had the silent support of the Greek people, if you can.

17N wasn't considered a danger, and that explains the things I already mentioned. From this to liked or to silent support there's a great distance, wouldn't you say?

[VetLegion]

Ok, I could not resist, but this is my last post, honest.

BBC quote is on the first page of the thread, where they say general opinion was that 17N were taking care of 'bad people'.

But the idea that 17N had government support is advanced by you yourself...

Bolding is mine.

Originally posted by paiktis22

quote:
Originally posted by VetLegion

And I bet CIA were not that mean either. How many secrets in Greece get kept for 30 years? I can see why it seemed to them like serious government tolerance and thus - "terrorist heaven"

More conspiracy theories
Perhaps you should see all the relevent legislation to tackle with this problem since 1970's onward. Perhaps the extreme confidentiality of 17N which was unparalleled in any other terrorist organization in Europe coupled with poor policework and youd arrive to conclusions without feeding your paranoia?

Paiktis, poor policework for 30 years = government tolerance. I'm sure you are aware of that.

If I were having a case, I would rest it now.

[edited spelling and other stuff]

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by VetLegion


Ok, I could not resist, but this is my last post, honest.

BBC quote is on the first page of the thread, where they say general oppinion was that 17N were taking care of 'bad people'.

Read more closely. The father of one of the assasinated said that. Not the BBC. And he is free to his opinion and to his grief.

Paiktis, poor policework = government tolerance.

Really? To your mind perhaps.

Then the US gov. was collaborating with Osama for 9/11 I assume. Because someone didn't do his work right there too

Perhaps you should also read the government legislation that was enacted after the 1970's. Police's mistakes and incompetence is just that.