Zhukov or Guderian

[Lancer]

Imran brought up Zhukov, so here ya go...

[Shogun Gunner]

I still like Guderian..... Grandpa of the Lightning War!

Zhukov was good, perhaps could have better without Stalin looking over his shoulder....that should scare anyone.

[Boris Godunov]

Guderian, hands down.

Zhukov's successes were built on large part of sheer luck, the ineptness/bad luck of his opponents and his willingness to send his own men into a meat grinder. I think this sums it up nicely:

http://www.monarch.net/users/miller/ww2/history/Heroes_Zhukov.htm

[monkspider]

Hasty Heinz.

[techumseh]

Guderian spent much of the war outside actual field positions. He was responsible for developing the blitzkreig doctrine and organizing the German panzer troops.

Guderian's actual field commands were a Panzer Corps in Poland and France, and the 2nd Panzergruppe in Russia. He was defeated by Zuhkov before Moscow in December 1941, after which he was relieved by Hitler. He later became chief of the General Staff until fired again by Hitler in March 1945.

All of which begs the question. Who was the better general, Guderian, or the guy who beat him?

[techumseh]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Guderian, hands down.

Zhukov's successes were built on large part of sheer luck, the ineptness/bad luck of his opponents and his willingness to send his own men into a meat grinder. I think this sums it up nicely:

http://www.monarch.net/users/miller/...oes_Zhukov.htm

This is not an objective assesment, IMHO. Can you say who wrote it and what their qualifications might be?

[POTUS]

Guderian was the theorist and strategist, Zhukov the soldier who fought, and won.

[Az]

I also think that Zhukov deserves lots of credit for managing the logistics of far larger forces, esp. later on.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Guderian, hands down.

Zhukov's successes were built on large part of sheer luck, the ineptness/bad luck of his opponents and his willingness to send his own men into a meat grinder. I think this sums it up nicely:

http://www.monarch.net/users/miller/...oes_Zhukov.htm

That isn't evidence, it's barely veiled opinion. I vote for Guderian as well, but I think Zhukov was a decent general. His great skill was being able to develop a battle to his liking on an operational level, much as Wellesley was able to do against Napolean tactically. He was of course given a rather free hand to do so by Stalin which was nice for him, and of course excellent Soviet intelligence at the highest levels of the Wehrmacht helped immensely. Still, he was often able gain a massive superiority on selected parts of the front despite often being on the defensive and the enemy having air superiority, which compromises operational security significantly.

[Kropotkin]

One of the first things I think of when I hear or read the name Zhukov is that unfortunate start to the final assault on Berlin. Zhukov set up hundereds of lights towards the enemies position so that his troops would attack out of the 'sun'. Instead the lights reflected on the smoke from his enormous attilley barrage back and blinded his own frontoviks.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Kropotkin
One of the first things I think of when I hear or read the name Zhukov is that unfortunate start to the final assault on Berlin. Zhukov set up hundereds of lights towards the enemies position so that his troops would attack out of the 'sun'. Instead the lights reflected on the smoke from his enormous attilley barrage back and blinded his own frontoviks.

Fortunately for the Russians, the Germans put those lights out real quickly.

[Kropotkin]

Not that it matted much for Zhukov in the end, my grandmother could have won that campaign.

[Shirt]

Zhukov was good, but didn't exactly bring anything new to the table besides an ability to not get replaced by Stalin on a regular basis.

[Az]

I think you're underestimating this huge achievement.

[Winston]

This is getting old.

Reminds me a bit of Slowwhand's eternal birthday threads, every other day of the year a new thread on basically the same subject. A bit much I think.