Hopefully Some Good Economic News That Will Last

[Lord Merciless]

Originally posted by Cruddy
The UK experience of tax cuts over many years has changed. To start with they were very popular. When people realized that the govt wasn't maintaining public services and was selling everything to the highest bidder, the public decided that the govt spending the money was the best bet.

Else what do we vote for? For politicians who manage nothing, just sell off govt run services?

I suspect the US experience will be similar, with people getting disillusioned about the idea.

Well, maybe you brits are already hopelessly dependent on government programs.

To be honest, I want policians to manage as little as possible, and I want individual citizens to take as much initiative as possible. In America, we value initiative over dependency.

I trust politians less with my money than corporate CEOs. At least many corporate CEOs have a major stake in their own companies, and thus they work hard to get a decent return on investment. Politicians, especially the likes of Gray Davis of California, don't care a **** about whether public's money gets wasted. The more you give, the more they are going to waste.

Of course, there are some services only a government can perform, such as national defense, law enforcement, jurisdiction, monetary policy, corporate oversight, and social security. But efficiencies of these services are described as "appalling" to the best.

[Sava]

hmm... 1% of Americans getting an average of $40k per family to "invest" or healthcare for everyone plus change...

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Defiant
In any event, we all know the President, Slick Willy or Bush have little to do with the economy, that is mostly business's and Greenspan.

President dumb**** talked down the ecnoomy, ala Jimmy Carter's "national malaise." His tax cuts weren't targetted towards stimulating spending, which increases demand, but towards the investor class, which increases supply. We've got more than enough supply. We need more demand.

Normally, a President doesn't have that much effect on the economy, (at least as far as Repugs are concerned since the ecnoomy under the last three Repug prez' hasn't been that great, while under the last Dum prez, it was pretty good), but this Prez has had an extremely negative effect on his country. There is a reason why he's gonna go down as the worst Prez in history.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Lord Merciless
I trust politians less with my money than corporate CEOs

Then you are a complete fool.

[JohnT]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


What I'm saying is, that isn't necessarily true. Putting the money in the bank is only indirectly spending if the bank can invest the money.

But I thought they were investing it in overseas sweatshops designed specifically to exploit the poor? Isn't that the point of your "where are American jobs going" thread a few days ago?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by JohnT
But I thought they were investing it in overseas sweatshops designed specifically to exploit the poor? Isn't that the point of your "where are American jobs going" thread a few days ago?

No.

[Lord Merciless]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Then you are a complete fool.

Did you read my post at all? I said there are still MANY CEOs who have a major stakes in their own companies and thus in your investments. But there are no politicans who have a stake in your money.

I would trust Warren Buffet, Jerry Yang, Sergei Brin, Scott McNealy, and Bill Gates far more with my money than the forked-tongued snakes crawling in the US Congress and California State assembly.

[JohnT]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara

Then you are a complete fool.

You know, I'm a damned fool for getting into these threads as people tend to ignore every single bit of actual experience that I've had in my life so they can debate the latest "What if..." scenario that has no relation at all as to how the real world works. However, I did write something in a thread a while back that bears on this exchange and, if I may, I'd like to re-post it:

I am President of two companies with a total of 8 employees (including myself) and a fair number of contractors. My 8 employees have a total of 28 family members depending upon them for some portion of their incomes (in a couple of cases, the only portion). It is my responsibility to make sure that payroll is met, that new clients are developed, that invoices are paid, etc. It is my goal to increase our business so that in time I will be responsible for hundreds of employees and their families, rather than the dozens I am today.

So do I feel guilty? Hell no: I'm already doing my share.

I feel better now. You may keep ignoring me.

[Defiant]

"Normally, a President doesn't have that much effect on the economy, (at least as far as Repugs are concerned since the ecnoomy under the last three Repug prez' hasn't been that great, while under the last Dum prez, it was pretty good), but this Prez has had an extremely negative effect on his country. There is a reason why he's gonna go down as the worst Prez in history."

Che, that is just flat out wrong, first in March 2001 the market crashed then in September the other crash and then finally some corporate CEO's got their lunch, all factors of which killed any faith and trust into our economy, of which Bush had no or little control, that's plain and simple. His tax cuts were used to stimulate the economy which they have done, so far. Even if some used it to re-invest, great, lets create some real substance jobs, not like in the 90's .com rage which really hurt us. I think your personal bias of the man is hindering your intellectual thought of this economy and what he is trying to do.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by JohnT
I feel better now. You may keep ignoring me.

Enron, Worldcom, Global Crrossing, Tyco, Authur Anderson, Harken . . .

[JohnT]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Enron, Worldcom, Global Crrossing, Tyco, Authur Anderson, Harken . . .

But I repeat myself...

Since we're spewing names at random, how about these

Pol Pot, Stalin, Lenin, Mao, Amin

Looks like the body count is again heavily on your side - as a matter of fact, I can't find anything (I'm sure you'll help) that explicitly states that the companies you mentioned murdered a single person, much less millions. How about my list - any murderers there?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Defiant
I think your personal bias of the man is hindering your intellectual thought of this economy and what he is trying to do.

The reverse is true. This economy and what he is trying to do have influenced my personal bias of this man. I used to think he was gonna be like his father or Ronnie. I wouldn't like it, but I could live with it. But he's gone far beyond them.

This guy makes me fear for the future of the country. He is systematically ripping apart those aspects of the Federal government which protect us from predatory businesses, throwing us into massive debt, trying to keep the American people from finding out what they're doing behind closed doors, punishing whistleblowers, packing the court with evangalist Christian activists, and kicking the poor in the shins. He is Damien.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by JohnT
Amin

Idi Amin wasn't a socialist or a communist.


and answer my pm!

[JohnT]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Idi Amin wasn't a socialist or a communist.


and answer my pm!

I did. I sent you an email about a 1/2 hour ago at your bellsouth address.

[Defiant]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara

This guy makes me fear for the future of the country. He is systematically ripping apart those aspects of the Federal government which protect us from predatory businesses, throwing us into massive debt, trying to keep the American people from finding out what they're doing behind closed doors, punishing whistleblowers, packing the court with evangalist Christian activists, and kicking the poor in the shins. He is Damien.

OK, Che, now I have to ask you what you are drinking. Just yesterday didn't *his* federal judges just strip the Alabama Chief Justice because he wouldn't remove the 10 commandments from the court building. Isn't he the first one to start pushing for laws against guys like Enron, I agree the penalties are not strong enough but didn't he push for those and for the poor maybe he is trying to quit giving the handouts and trying to get jobs for them, we have conditioned some people(i see here at work) to leech off the system not help it and I am tried of seeing it.