Should every person on Apolyton feel extremely guilty?

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by skywalker
Yes, but it that law is WRONG. It is WRONG to punish someone for not doing something RIGHT.

Again, otherwise the logical conclusion is a totalitarian state in which everyone is required to be perfect.

I disagree. It is simply another (broader) definition of your duties.

[Kuciwalker]

Nope. In that example, the LOGICAL conclusion is that it is your DUTY to do the RIGHT thing, and therefore it should be illegal to NOT do the RIGHT thing. Thus, you have a totalitarian state.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Elok


Generally a safe statement to make.

As to the actual thread, well, I have no idea how to answer it without dipping into theology, but I agree to some extent with the starter. We'll leave it at that.

Actually, while I find him to be knowledgeable, I disagree with MTG on a number of things . . . its just in this case there is nothing gained by feeling guilty and I agree with him.

[Combat Ingrid]

Originally posted by skywalker
I am only responsible for what I CAUSE, not what I don't prevent.

Looking for a career as a politician?

[Kuciwalker]

In the case of a politician, if it is their job (translate: DUTY) to prevent something, then not performing their job is WRONG.

EDIT: Same goes for a firefight who gets a 911 call and then decides he doesn't feel like going down there, etc

[Pekka]

I've thought about this.. I don't know if I feel guilty about it, but I feel sometimes something. About the third world and poor people. I mean the very poor people.

I have an option to think about and drive myself crazy and label myself as a bad person for not helping as much as I could. Or, I could help some. But in order to 'feel good' about myself would mean giving up everything I have and ever will have to help the poor people. Everything, starting from my computer. How many people would live for how long with that money? I bet many people would last a lot longer. If I don't give it my all and really try to help as much as possible, then what am I doing? Trying to make an excuse to feel good about myself.. I did something, right? Wrong, I could do more. I could help more.

So I just chose not to feel guilty about it.

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by skywalker
Nope. In that example, the LOGICAL conclusion is that it is your DUTY to do the RIGHT thing, and therefore it should be illegal to NOT do the RIGHT thing.

It is not your duty to do always the right thing, but it is your duty to help eg. those victims if you can. It does not follow that you have to be perfect. Eg. when you´re giving first aid to a injured guy you cannot be blamed if you make a mistake during this process, because you aren´t a qualified doctor.

Thus, you have a totalitarian state.

No, because it is safe to say that the majority of people would like to have help in such cases. Therefore the majority of society would consider such a law ok, so you can´t speak of a totalitarian state in this case.

[Gatekeeper]

People don't have to help *all* the time to be of assistance to others. If they help just some of the time, that's better than never. Ideally, all the time would be nice, but then we begin running into the very nature of what it is to be human. And that debate is one that's been going for thousands of years ...

Gatekeeper

[Pekka]

Yes, and since you can't help all, you choose who you help. I choose to help my friends and family always and they come first no matter what. After that I can help others too, if it means giving money. And that time should come when I start making money. I figure I can give to charity no problems.

[Lincoln]

I think that most of us should feel guilty but we have justified our indifference. The socialist justifies his by paying more taxes, thinking he is saving the world and getting the poor away from his front door. The libertarian justifies his indifference by helping himself, thinking that universal greed creates a system where the poor can lift themselves up by their own bootstraps. The Capitalist justifies his greed by giving crumbs to the poor from time to time. And we here at Apolyton play silly games on the computer and argue about the problems in the world, thinking that by talking about them we don't really need to help our neighbor unless he knocks on the door screaming that he has been shot. Then we call 911 and look out the window thinking we have done a great service to mankind.

[Pekka]

And in case of Africa for example.. Sometimes I do feel kind of bad about eating when I'm already full and then throwing the rest to carbage, and then come here to complain because I can't buy a swimming pool right now.
Sure..

.. but I'm also frustrated sometimes, that it seems like no matter how much you'd give money there, they'd still be in trouble. Giving money is short term solution, and while thinking about the long term helping, naturally there needs to be short term solutions as well. But I admit, that I'm sometiems angry at some African people that when someone is trying to help them, granted the helping is too low level, they still fight all the time and it makes it so much worse. I don't know if I'm justified to be frustrated and angry about that sometimes, but it comes naturally to me, and I don't think it makes me a bad person.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

I don't feel guilty. It's one of the few inherent benefits of psychopathy.

[Alex]

Originally posted by skywalker
It is WRONG to punish someone for not doing something RIGHT.

Again, otherwise the logical conclusion is a totalitarian state in which everyone is required to be perfect.

Society has decided that life is something to be preserved. If you see someone drowning in a pool and you can swim but you don't try to save that person, then you are responsible for his eventual death. You'll not be punished because you didn't do something right, you're going to be punished because you broke the law.

[Bereta_Eder]

Even Julian Cope feels guilty.

[Lincoln]

Well Pekka, at least you care. That is a good start. Sometimes we just fall into opportunities to do some good. Supporting corrupt governments in Africa (or charities that are filtered through the corruption) isn't too helpful to the people who actually need the care. I used to work with homeless people a little and it turned out to be a joke. But on the other hand I am continually amazed at how much money the West has to squander and how a few dollars would do so much to simply help one kid who would like to have a chance at life.

I get emails from a volunteer in an orphanage in Thailand that will have to shut down this year because they are broke. The kids can go to hell as long as we have a new computer. We, in the prosperous West are like the "rich man and Lasarus" parable in the Bible. We throw crumbs to the beggars and then blow a trumpet to tell everyone how much we care.