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First off I'd like to say that this thread is for those that will not waste all our time by discussing the irrelevant propaganda-issues put out by USUK leadership regarding weapons of mass destruction or the evilness of Saddam or 45-minutes or World security or any of the other chewing-gum-topics divulged for the benifit of the voting public.
The US and UK invaded Iraq to gain control of the oil supplies of the second biggest oil producer after Saudi Arabia, they did this because industrial society runs on oil, it's as simple as that.
What I want to discuss is what you think we should be more afraid of:
The lies, cynicism, brutality, and willingness to bend/twist/manipulate/manufacture and forget the truth and history, as practised by the US and UK leadership- so that they could invade an entire country, destroy it's infastructure, and render all the protests from within their 'democracies' irrelevant, and causing all the 'serious debate' in the West to confine itself to made-up issues that have nothing to do with their [USUK leaderships] real motivations, while the soldiers and oil-men plod on with doing what they're really there to do (occupying the land and contracting-up the spoils of war)
or
That the Leadership of the US and UK think that it is necessary to do these things, because they beleive that controlling the Oil is worth it... because when the oil supply to the West runs out, Industrial society will end, and it would run out/be prone to impossible levels of manipulation sooner, had they not invaded Iraq.
In decades agriculture and translocation will buckle under the price of energy, people will starve, people will freeze, economies will crash. Without energy, or with overly expensive energy, even America could become like a 3rd world country, and California-class energy failures will become more widespread. Perhaps the men who run the US and UK, were actually taking very sobre steps to prevent the end of the world as we know it... perhaps the real reason they went to war- to secure the vast energy reserves we depend on to run the 'modern world', is justified?
Discuss...
Personaly I don't think it is justified, the modern world could find or build the infrastructure to derive alternative energy sources, but as things currently stand, energy is refined/transported and processed by a select few, an 'Energy Elite'.
The oil-moguls and their cousins in the military/industrial/corporate conglomorate aren't interested in finding alternate sources of 'sustainable energy' as this would take the power from their hands, and lead to the 'democratization of energy'. Imagine everybody having their own rooftop solar-plant or bio-waste methane plant! The horror! Therefore their lobbies will continue to support the worlds dependance on non-sustainable high-yield oil-energy because it keeps them rich and powerful, even though it is finite, and running out.
And because the oil is running out we will see more energy wars launched by the US (a very energy-hungry beast) disguised as humanitarianism or anti-terrorizm or WMD-control in the future.
The whole thing is merely an extension of the Kissinger plan first floated in the mid-seventies concerned with 'seizing Arab oil supplies', thereby placing the US in a position to 'control the worlds economies' (China, Europe, Russia and the rest).
The US and UK invaded Iraq to gain control of the oil supplies of the second biggest oil producer after Saudi Arabia, they did this because industrial society runs on oil, it's as simple as that.
What I want to discuss is what you think we should be more afraid of:
The lies, cynicism, brutality, and willingness to bend/twist/manipulate/manufacture and forget the truth and history, as practised by the US and UK leadership- so that they could invade an entire country, destroy it's infastructure, and render all the protests from within their 'democracies' irrelevant, and causing all the 'serious debate' in the West to confine itself to made-up issues that have nothing to do with their [USUK leaderships] real motivations, while the soldiers and oil-men plod on with doing what they're really there to do (occupying the land and contracting-up the spoils of war)
or
That the Leadership of the US and UK think that it is necessary to do these things, because they beleive that controlling the Oil is worth it... because when the oil supply to the West runs out, Industrial society will end, and it would run out/be prone to impossible levels of manipulation sooner, had they not invaded Iraq.
In decades agriculture and translocation will buckle under the price of energy, people will starve, people will freeze, economies will crash. Without energy, or with overly expensive energy, even America could become like a 3rd world country, and California-class energy failures will become more widespread. Perhaps the men who run the US and UK, were actually taking very sobre steps to prevent the end of the world as we know it... perhaps the real reason they went to war- to secure the vast energy reserves we depend on to run the 'modern world', is justified?
Discuss...
Personaly I don't think it is justified, the modern world could find or build the infrastructure to derive alternative energy sources, but as things currently stand, energy is refined/transported and processed by a select few, an 'Energy Elite'.
The oil-moguls and their cousins in the military/industrial/corporate conglomorate aren't interested in finding alternate sources of 'sustainable energy' as this would take the power from their hands, and lead to the 'democratization of energy'. Imagine everybody having their own rooftop solar-plant or bio-waste methane plant! The horror! Therefore their lobbies will continue to support the worlds dependance on non-sustainable high-yield oil-energy because it keeps them rich and powerful, even though it is finite, and running out.
And because the oil is running out we will see more energy wars launched by the US (a very energy-hungry beast) disguised as humanitarianism or anti-terrorizm or WMD-control in the future.
The whole thing is merely an extension of the Kissinger plan first floated in the mid-seventies concerned with 'seizing Arab oil supplies', thereby placing the US in a position to 'control the worlds economies' (China, Europe, Russia and the rest).
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