"Conservatives only use hate & fear while Liberals use logic & reason."

[Verres]

Originally posted by Kropotkin
Ned: I do belive elijah pointed to the original meaning of the word. That's 'love of wisdom'. At least until some genius tells us that this is a missunderstanding of ancient greek.

As far as i know, you are right. (And Imran, dont even try to call me 'silly' for saying this. When it comes to classics I could crush you with the tip of my finger)

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
To say that idealism can NEVER be reality is simply being silly.

Well, if it becomes reality, then surely it has gone into the realms of realism. It has gone from being an idealistic view into a realistic one. Idealism, IMHO, seems to have the purpose of coming up with ideals, with ideas of what is great, regardless of possibilities. Realism has the same, but with the constraint of what is possible, or even what is probable. They both have the same purpose, to improve humanity, but idealism admits that it is the ideal, the thought that matters, whereas realism purports that the effect, the result, is what is important. That is what I see as the difference.

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

Political philosophies are by their very nature realistic.

And can be idealistic as well. For example, Woodrow Wilson's "14 points" were an idealistic political philosophy.

But the nature of being political, of being something that is possible, makes it realistic. It can be a realistic ideal.

[Whaleboy]

The whole point of idealism is to change the current reality

Read Plato.

And can be idealistic as well. For example, Woodrow Wilson's "14 points" were an idealistic political philosophy

Do the Americans enjoy irritating the French?

A silly argument. What happens with an 'ideal' becomes the reality? Yes, it is no longer 'ideal', because it has come to pass, BUT you cannot deny that an idealistic principal HAS become reality

I believe you think idealism means progressive. It is not. You are talking about liberalism

To say that idealism can NEVER be reality is simply being silly

See above.

[Ned]

Look at the title to this thread: Liberals use logic and reasoning. This is exactly what philosophy is to a point. But philosophy is the search for truth using logic and reasoning. To deny that their is truth as a starting premise, one must only conclude that the philosophy of liberal relativists is the use of logic and reason in search of something other than the truth.

[Verres]

I really would have thought the vocabulary of a deity could extend beyond the word 'silly'...

[Whaleboy]

Verres: Perhaps, but it would help to explain the Middle East wouldn't it?

[Verres]

[Maniac]

I fully agree with Imran Siddiqui in this thread.

[Whaleboy]

Ned: Truth is that there is no truth. Pretty basic stuff. You can go round and round in circles arguing "there is truth, no there isnt" and I'll win, but the equilibrium to that conflict is idealistic truth. My truth is different to yours. Objectively, there is none. Simple really.

[Verres]

You have good reason to look worried...

[Whaleboy]

I fully agree with Imran Siddiqui in this thread.

Opinion of Belgium is going dooowwn. jk

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Maniac
I fully agree with Imran Siddiqui in this thread.

We really don't want to start on the nature of logic do we I still have to write the next Meditations though

BTW: Have played the turn

[Kuciwalker]

elijah, pure relativism is stupid. It may be flawlessly logical, but when applied to the real world it DOESN'T WORK.

[Whaleboy]

Its called off topic for a reason Drogue!

[Verres]

Speaking of which, hasnt this whole thread gone rather off the topic???