Conscription

[David Floyd]

Imran,

Conscription is NOT morally wrong when faced with a substantial threat to the state. By living in the country you enter into an implicit contract that you will fight for the country if it needs you. If you don't like that implicit contract then you can move out.

That's just the way it is. Who cares if you don't like it and think it's slavery? Leave the country then and don't come back so your implied contract is nullified.

Again, EVEN IF this were true, it does not answer the point of conscription being slavery and immoral, which is the entire point.

No... age limits are practical, and perfectly acceptable. Young people are immature and don't have experience.

That's just silly. A 17 year old can be more mature than a 21 year old, and a 21 year old can have less experience than a 17 year old. Yet the 21 year old can do some things a 17 year old legally can't.

Personally, I don't think 8 year olds are capable of driving 4,000 vehicles. But I'm sure the ACLU would commend your outspoken support of the enslaved children of America.

Did I ever say they could or should?

[Pekka]

And I'm all for pro army. I'm all for volunteers. But do you think conscription would be used if it wasn't necessary?


It's like this. When I apply my citizenship for the US after many years, I'll promise to do what the gameplan is. Because I agree with it's terms, and they give me citizenship for it. You must give some to get some. I then pledge my loyalty to it, and if something comes up, I'll defend it too. Nothing is free.

[David Floyd]

Cockney,

whether or not you think britain should have entered ww1 is wholly irrelevent. the government and the public at large thought belgium was worth going to war and we did so.

But the point is, politicians shouldn't force people who don't agree to get them out of situations that are the politicians' fault to begin with.

we did have our back against the wall, our armies in france were under pressure and we simply didn't have enough men to replace losses, our allies' armies were in a far worse state.

Maybe you should have thought of that before starting a war.

we were 6 weeks away from starvation in 1917 due to german submarine action.

And many Germans were starving due to your blockade, so I don't feel very sorry for poor little Britain. In any case, we are talking about 1916, not 1917, are we not?

And as to your backs being against the wall, you could easily have made peace if you had wanted to.

Now, I have to go to work. I'll be back later.

[Sava]

That's just silly. A 17 year old can be more mature than a 21 year old, and a 21 year old can have less experience than a 17 year old. Yet the 21 year old can do some things a 17 year old legally can't.

Then devise a plan to effectively test maturity for millions of people and sell it to the government. Until then, age is the best way of limiting inexperienced youth from operating heavy machinery, purchasing liquor, and entering legal contracts.

[Imran Siddiqui]

EVEN IF this were true, it does not answer the point of conscription being slavery and immoral, which is the entire point.

It is neither. It's simply your social duty... which is not immoral, nor slavery. If you have a duty to do something, it cannot be slavery, and since it is for society's benefit, it cannot be immoral (except to certain wacked out individuals ).

[Ming]

It is not slavery... it's a contract between you and your country. One that comes with citizenship. If the country requires it... then you must agree because that's part of the deal. That is by no means slavery. You do have the choice to say no... renounce your citizenship... or suffer the penality by going to jail.

So stop calling it something it isn't... it's not slavery, and it certainly isn't immoral.

[Velociryx]

But Miiiing! He thinks that it his his god-given RIGHT to enjoy all the riches and opportunity that being a citizen of this country can offer without paying anything for it....without ever giving anything back....and IF you make him (tax him, force him to serve to protect it), it's immoral....



-=Vel=-

[Sava]

good point Ming...

btw, Floyd, aren't you against welfare because you don't want your money going to people who didn't earn it? I'm sure veterans might feel the same about you. You are enjoying the freedoms you didn't earn, and others died for.

[GePap]

When you see Sava, Boris, Imran, Vel, and Ming all agree on one point (one I also agree with), you can almost feel that on the other end must be DF.

[Pekka]

Ming, that's what I've been trying to say all along!


But I feel that if conscription is NOT necessary, it shouldn't be forced. Only when it's absolutely necessary.

[Al B. Sure!]

Edited by Ming... one more racist post like that and you are toast Albert.

Take your racist agenda somewhere else.

[Ming]

Whose to say whether it's necessary or not. Having a standing army available might be considered necessary by some people.

Frankly... I think all young men and women should have a mandatory 1 or 2 year service to their country... whether it's in the military or communty service... It would teach them that freedom doesn't come for free, and that EVERYBODY needs to do their share. Many people have died so that we can enjoy the freedoms that we do have...

[DinoDoc]

Why does Floyd feel the need to start threads at odd intervals over a topic that the US military would rather not see reinstated?

[Pekka]

AS, you'd love it here. Everyone goes. The rich the poor, the fortunate and the unfortunate. Everyone gets to die with equal share of all classes. To be honest, I think it's quite beautiful thing. It is something most people will never understand... but to me, it's like lifes finers things like classical music (which I have just have learned to appreciate and LOVE, poweful stuff). It's total harmony, it's represents all that is beautiful. When every guy is determined, no one even wants to stay home, and are ready to take what's coming. It's like silence before the storm.. it's kind of scary, but it's beautiful and there's power in it. It's like a feeling there's no word in our vocabulary. It's not about killing or dying or blood. It's about the harmony and the will. The determined will, it's so pure it must be something huge. I can't explain it at all... no one gets paid. There's no money involved, nothing. Just the common will and spirit, but it is often under estimated.

Oh well..

[Pekka]

I'm just a romantic type of guy