TIME: "Why America is Running Out of Gas"

[Odin]

Originally posted by Oerdin
The US still has monsterous sized proven reserves of natural gas. We just haven't built the distribution system to get it were it needs to go largely because we've had three decades of enviromentalists obstructing new projects due to their absolutely pathological hatred for anything to do with the oil/gas industry.

I am enviromentalist, but if you coulden't beleive anything Big Oil sad you would probably do the same thing.

TREE HUGGERS R GOOD!!!

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Azazel




The thing is, the amount of research done is pityful in comparison to the enormous big ****ing huge ass hyper super duper I-cannot-overestimate-this Bonanza that would come from Fusion power.

What is the percentage of Fusion research as a part of government spending? And then, you build another COMPLETELY UNNEEDED carrier.

It's a shame really. Even a capitalist sees it. I am sure that the US' greatest presidents, Linocln, Roosvelt 1, FDR, Ike, they'd all agree that the USA is going the WRONG way in things.

Bah! They're all aircraft carriers now.

[Sava]

Sava, think for a second (I know it is hard ). Trees and walls aren't going to be made from the same flimsy materials that cars will be .

You don't know much about physics, eh? Or do you have a "BA" in that as well?

Impact time is what kills in accidents.... G forces... etc... It doesn't matter if you are in a tank. If you hit somethings... a tree, a building, etc... the impact time kills. By making vehicles out of weaker materials, the car absorbs the impact energy, thereby increasing the impact time. Even a .05 of a second can mean the difference between life and death. A person has no better chance of surviving a crash in an SUV than in a lighter vehicle if the impact time is small. Because of their rigid design, SUV's and other vehicles are actually more dangerous.

If you hit a concrete pillar going 45 mph, it doesn't matter what vehicle you are in... seatbelts and airbags make more difference than materials used in the vehicle's construction.

It's not about safety... it's not about consumer demands... it's about oil profits. I only hope one day you will realize how the world works.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Felch
The biggest problem for natural gas is not SUVs, but rather gas-fired power plants. Because of environmental controls that discourage coal use, most new power plants are being fueled by gas. This along with a lack of increase in the supply of the fuel, has led to the dramatic increase in price, from around $2 per million BTU to around $5 over the past few years.

I didn't bother reading the article, but considering you keep bringing up SUVs Sava, I doubt you really understand the issue.

You are exactly right about the natural gas shortage. It was created by idiotic government environmental policy, and it was quite obvious it was going to happen for years. So states like California built a lot of natural gas fueled electrical generation plants, and now there is a gas shortage. Well duh!

Did anyone in the government stop to think for just a second that natural gas does a lot of things well for which there is no ready substitute? If you want to heat something in a populated area natural gas is uniquely capable of doing it cleanly and efficiently. Now the power plant will burn the gas (that you can no longer afford) and turn it into electricity (at a steep loss in energy from its potential) which you can then use to heat your soup (at an even steeper loss). Fvcking morons!

[Sava]

are you high Odin?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Lastly, did you folks hear about the previous "reformulated" gasoline the left wing nutjobs forced onto us in California? It contained MTBE which the Sierra Club insisted, spending millions and lobbying the state assembly, had to be included in gasoline so it could reduce emissions by 2%.

From everything I've read, it's the environmentalists who were trying to stop the use of MTBE. In a odd switch, Canada is the ones trying to force it down California's throat, by suing the US under NAFTA saying that the banning of MTBE is an unfair trade restriction. They're suing for $750 million dollars. Fortunately for California, they won't have to foot the bill. That's the Fed's bill, since they signed the treaty, not California.

[Dinner]

I remember the case well. The Sierra Club is the single biggest lobbying group in the state and they were putting their total weight behind it. Five years later, after MBTE start showing up in well water, the Sierra Club reversed course and backed California's effort to Ban MTBE. The funny fact remains that MTBE would never have been used if the Sierra Club and other enviromental groups hadn't acted in such an extream fashion by insisting the scientific community didn't know what they were talking about.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Ted Striker
Well you can get the hydrogen from natural gas.

Up until recently the US had a surplus of domestic natural gas.

When did you quit that "all bean diet"?

[DarthVeda]

You want a solution? Enforce mileage laws on the books. Make Trucks and light vehicles, and cars all require 25 mpg from the producers and not just as an average. This is easily obtainable now with hybrid cars. There is no reason for cars to have less than 40 mpg as a requirement.

Here's my idea:

1) Re-instate the 1985 law that requires ALL vehicles to have a minimum mileage of 25 miles per gallon. Right now SUV's and trucks are exempt from this law. Cars only have to average 25 mpg, so some can be below as long as enough to average it out are sold above.
2) Require that cars (light vehicles, ie not SUVs or trucks) sold in the United States average at 45 mpg.
3) Have this all in place by 2008.
4) Have tax incentives for motorists that convert their cars/trucks to the hybrid standard.

Auto makers that fail to comply will get a fine per car sold.

This is easily feasible.

[Sava]

see how much GOP support you get for that Veda...

[Az]

Originally posted by Sikander


Bah! They're all aircraft carriers now.

Ironic, isn't it? I am sure they'd use the money for other things.

[GePap]

The worse thing the articl predicts will happen is higher energy prices..Oh God, no!!!!!!!! OPh, and continued relience on outside energy products. And all I ahve to say is "No sh1t sherlock". at least, in the US.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Azazel


Ironic, isn't it? I am sure they'd use the money for other things.

Don't you see azazel: we have to wait for private enterprise to attempt to make Fusion commercially viable, becuase we all know how inefficient the gov is. private fusion will be much more effective than public fusion.