real-life reeducation centers

[Az]

And if a kid doesn't give a ****?

[Provost Harrison]

Well, they should be assisted in whatever professional capacity is necessary, not these torture camps...

[Q Classic]

it is interesting to note that jamaica says little because it's an economic engine there...

[Adalbertus]

Azazel,
Such issues are with 99% certainty previous failures of the adults. I see no reason in punishing kids for that. Quite often, parents think they have something like a cute dog and are completely surprised by the fact that a kid starts to think for itself.

I admire my grandpa for that he took my mother with him to a pub, saying that the best place for a girl to learn what alcohol is, are her parents.

Also, as already mentioned there is another situation where mutual confidence is difficult. My grandma was (I think) around 17 and fresh in love with a young man (see above), when her mother burst out into tears :"you don't love me". My grandma had all problems to console her. That's how she learned she was adopted.

I just try to imagine "17 is too young, go to tranquility bay" ...

My grandmother was still in love with him as a 17-year-old when she died in 1997 (and 16 years after him)
Destroying a personality like done in those camps is one of the few things I rate worse than murder.

[Kassiopeia]

Adalbertus's got it. It's repulsive how parents use these camps to correct their own mistakes in raising children. Face it - they don't become troubled teenagers magically by some unknown force. It's in the parents. The environment might have something to do with it, but parents ought to be able to counter that, if they really care about their kids. Things like these camps make me second-guess the basic human right of reproduction, sadly.

If they send off a kid for just dissenting with them, i.e. being a teenager, then that's just even more revolting. These camps step on the human rights of these children - no privacy, no sexuality, no free thought. It's frightening. These people that call themselves their parents should have no right to their children.

Some say these things are better than the kids ending up in prison. Well, to end up in prison at least there's a justice system to regulate it. Apparently all there is needed for a pair of nuts to send their kids to a camp is enough cash.

Originally posted by ixnay

There's a huge thread on the Something Awful forums about this right now - the goons are using their mass swarming power for good, in an attempt to shut them down/raise public awareness of this. I'll keep you updated on any progress there.

for the goons.

[mrmitchell]

wonder why or how a parent could conceivably think it is a good idea to send their children there

Parents who send their kids to these places don't trust anyone. The common divorce/adoption demographic of the parents is mentioned in the article, and it's not a leap to say that your trust is damaged if the love of your life divorces you and leaves her kids to rot. The divorce heavily affects the children, who turn to illegal activities to deal with their problems because the adults are not offering any help. Then, emotionally damaged parents who know a hill of beans about children find Tranquility Bay or one of many other such organisations and think "This is how to save my child!" They are (1)irrational and do not consider that there can be any downsides at all or (2)hate their children subconsciously and want them to burn in hell.

A second possibility is that the parent once again has issues in trust, but not because of divorce. They just are suffocating maniacs who can't stand to let their children grow up and go out into the world. This kind is just as bad, if not worse, than the first. If they were informed of all the beating and knew that their kids would become obedient slaves, they would still put them in the program because "If it hurts so much, it has to work!" or once again they subconsciously enjoy seeing their children in pain.

Tranquility Bay uses a device of self-approval similar to the "denial" trap that is often used. As it goes, denial is the first sign of drug abuse, so if your kid says he's not on drugs, then obviously he's been tripping out on LSD for years and you never even noticed, you bad parent.

Unfortunately, people who can't see through even the denial trap don't really like the person they're accusing anyways (or do not have the capability of it). In some instances this can be because the parent was raised their child in the vision that he would fulfill all of the parent's dreams, and in some instances the child is too good and the parent starts feeling jealous, wishing that their own childhood could have been that fulfilling. Anyways I guess I'll quit my unchecked rambling unless someone dares to say I'm wrong.

[muxec]

A perfectly viable system.
There are two education methods "Eastern" and "Western". Eastern education is strict discipline and respect to the parent/teacher. Western education is democracy for not-working teens. Yes Eastern education may be wrong. Japanese samurais knew that they will be samurais in age of four. Maybe it's not too good but Western culture is wrong. When i read that american children copulate in age of 13 and it's considered normal I can not imagine it. When I read that in age of sixteen 95% of american boys tried narcotics at least once i'm getting shocked. How could it be? Do these parents really love their children or just say them "Do whatever you want but dont disturb me!" ? Why do they need their children? If they really love and need their children they would not allow children to do everything. If the good parent sees that the child recieves low grades in the school, he (parent) punishes him by not giving pocket money or (if it's not against local laws) punishes him physically. In some countries punishing a child is strictly forbidden. In USA parent who lashes his child even can be jailed. So how to affect the child? How to make him realize that he is not the only in the world and to teach him to be polite? These rich parents have the only choise- to send their childred to the Tranquility. Yes, children will have a bad time in their childhood, but they will die from drugs. They will not fail to find jobs just because they can not be polite. I think that parents who send their children to the Tranquility really love their children, they are not indifferent to their future lives.

When 3 years before we (with mom) imigrated to Israel I was sent to elite school known as shevahmofet (www.shevahmofet.org , the site is still under constraction). It's Russian school, but it's the best school in Israel according to the Ministry of Education. All my Israeli friends (except onliners) are from the school. About a year ago i was invited to 18-th birthday of my friend who already finished the school. Her boyfriend, who finished ordinary Israeli school, also was invited. Lets call him MrF for instanse. All other guests were from the my school. When one of my friends opened physics textbook (just for herself, not to show off) MrF took this like a personal insult. He said "your school is bad, one of my friends one year ago gone to your school, he was a normal guy, but now if i ivite him to party he replyes, that he is busy doing lessons. Your school 'corrupted' the nice boy". So people, do not be like MrF, dont accuse Tranquility without knowing it. I think, that must of tranquility students will thank Tranquility later.

[muxec]

What? Am i the only pro-Tranquilitist?

[mrmitchell]

muxec, do you not realise the irony?

[Az]

muxec:

[muxec]

Originally posted by mrmitchell
muxec, do you not realise the irony?

Yes i do not. Please point me exactly to the iron of your irony.

[muxec]

Originally posted by Azazel
muxec:

Why?

[Shi Huangdi]

Of course, solutions such as Tranquility Bay should be reserved only for severe cases, and it does seem as though there were cases in which they were sent there inappropriately.

But there can be truly severe cases among adolescents, kids who use drugs, kids who are violent, kids who refuse to obey any authority, kids who are excessively violent, kids who refuse to put forth any effort into school and fail courses. If enough factors are there, then whatever mistakes you have made in raising them in the past you shouldn't just let them continue on the path they are on, and it is right to intervene in some way.

[mrmitchell]

Yes i do not. Please point me exactly to the iron of your irony.

You praise it as though without it you would be dead on the streets, and yet that is exactly whut it is supposed to do--force you into believing you would have been dead on the streets without it.

[muxec]

Originally posted by mrmitchell

You praise it as though without it you would be dead on the streets, and yet that is exactly whut it is supposed to do--force you into believing you would have been dead on the streets without it.

Yes, without study I would really die on the street in Ukraine.