Slavery yet again in the USA?

[Az]

Yeah, well, it happens, even to me.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Actually, the study is wrong. They fail to include workers who would still be subject to state law overtime standards, which do not all fall under FLSA. (Some states use FLSA standards, some add to them).

States are free to impose more restrictive standards - the Federal labor law standards are just minimums states can't depart below.

[Proteus_MST]

Originally posted by Azazel
I really don't see the reason in making people work overtime, at all. why not measure people's job according to what they did, and not how much time they spent doing it?

How do yu measure what people do
(éspecially in some Positions in Administration)?

Numbers of pages written per day?
How many times a key on the Keyboard was pressed
or how much kilometers the mouse has been moved?

[St Leo]

Incompetent workers should be fired, not paid less. If they can't do a decent job, then they don't deserve more than the welfare pittance.

[Pekka]

proteus, you set goals and deadlines. Then with experience you can estimate how long it would take and not the '24/7, no breaks, fast pace' way, but you include possible problems that take more time, and that people are not machines. Realistical estimates.
Then you chop it to pieces, and set smaller goals that ultimately lead to bigger goal. That way you can estimate how much work should be done personally in one day or week, or so. If you complete it, good, you have worked enough for your position in this place, get out, go home. If not, then you do overtime. But it comes down to the estimates, and how realistical they are, and what different variables there are in the game (problems, things you can't really estimate).

So, I think how much person works is not about time, or how physical it is, or how much you have walked in the office. It's about getting the goals you have set, and finishing them in time.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat
States are free to impose more restrictive standards - the Federal labor law standards are just minimums states can't depart below.

Tell that to Florida. I worked OT at my last gig and didn't receive time and a half. At this job there's no point in working OT, since they only have a certain amount of money. If I run through it faster, I still only get the same amount, and they have less time to scrounge up more money to keep me around.

[Shi Huangdi]

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat
Actually, the study is wrong. They fail to include workers who would still be subject to state law overtime standards, which do not all fall under FLSA. (Some states use FLSA standards, some add to them).

States are free to impose more restrictive standards - the Federal labor law standards are just minimums states can't depart below.

to Bush then. This should be a matter to be decided by the States.

[Proteus_MST]

Originally posted by Pekka
proteus, you set goals and deadlines. Then with experience you can estimate how long it would take and not the '24/7, no breaks, fast pace' way, but you include possible problems that take more time, and that people are not machines. Realistical estimates.
Then you chop it to pieces, and set smaller goals that ultimately lead to bigger goal. That way you can estimate how much work should be done personally in one day or week, or so. If you complete it, good, you have worked enough for your position in this place, get out, go home. If not, then you do overtime. But it comes down to the estimates, and how realistical they are, and what different variables there are in the game (problems, things you can't really estimate).

So, I think how much person works is not about time, or how physical it is, or how much you have walked in the office. It's about getting the goals you have set, and finishing them in time.

Yes, that works for many jobs,
but there is also a number of jobs where this is very difficult to implement.
For example my Father is Human Resources Director. The work in the Department of Human Resources involves a lot of Routine work which just can´t divided into certain projects (like "Fire Person A and hire Person B"), for example the administration of Health Insurances, or to assign personnell to different Places of work, but also to cope with a lot of unexpected events, for example Personnel which gets injured and the like.
There is also a lot of work which is dependend on Inputs from other Departments.
One Example:
Every month the workers get a printout with informations about hours worked, money earned and of course how much money was retained for taxes, Health Insurance and the like (and Copies of thise Printouts are also kept within the files for every single worker).
Printing is done in the IT-Department, as well as certain other things which are important for the Payroll administration.
And after printing the numbers on Printouts are checked in the Department of Human Ressources.
So there are a lot of steps which could delay those printouts as there are a lot of people involved.
And it would be very difficult, maybe impossible to calculate those delays, as every single Person within the IT-Department also has other fields of work (after all there are a lot of Computers which have to be maintained) and there is no single person who just manages the Printout of those Payroll Informations.


So I think this Project/Goal Oriented Measurement may be applicable to some jobs, but it isn´t applicable for all.