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Originally posted by Menlas
Then, US army should already have invaded half of African countries...
Then, US army should already have invaded half of African countries...
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In all fairness to the US, had they wanted to invade an African country instead of IRaq, it would have been child's play to come up with some economic motive for attacking. Just replace "oil" with diamonds/copper/cobalt/whatever, or for that matter just keep the phrase as is. -
Really, deeds are much, much louder than words.Originally posted by GeneralTacticus
In all fairness to the US, had they wanted to invade an African country instead of IRaq, it would have been child's play to come up with some economic motive for attacking. Just replace "oil" with diamonds/copper/cobalt/whatever, or for that matter just keep the phrase as is.
So far, there's no NBC weapons. Given the amount of intelligence US supposed to have, plus all those implied sources, one would deduce that the US forces could home in on all those dreadful Iraqi caches of deadly weapons. So far, however, nothing.
Then, even before the war was over, the US had been giving out contracts to US companies, those with close links to the W admin.
After the war, we don't hear anything about this NBC weapons business. Instead, the US all of a sudden became very eager to lift the embargo that they were also equally eager to impose on Iraq after GWI.
Lastly, of course, there's just the news of the US is going to appoint new rulers for Iraq. Been there, seen that. Nothing new here.(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."Comment
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Well the current actions are in accordance with this ideology, the problems I can see are many with this view... but this is not the issue, it pretty much gives the good reasons for attacking Iraq and for holding it in present situation.Originally posted by DanS
Here's a short description of neoconservativism. This author puts Cheney as a neoconservative. I wouldn't label him that--he has been very coy about his real beliefs--but there you go.
It answers another question and that is the neo-cons are not ready, or do not have a legal base in international law for their ideas so they have to try and find legal precedents for attack what they tried with WOMD's.
And lastly "thinking" and actually accomplishing something is different, I just hope they don't screw up as much as they could... still one just have to look at Afghanistan and pace of changes there - so the country hasn't advanced much in the last year. It will be interesting if Iraqi democracy goes against it's "liberators" as it is very possible... and to see the importance of "Iraq democracy" if the democratic Iraq doesn't dance as the "liberator" says, will we see a pro-american dictator than?
... so it remains to be seen... but yes, the reasons for war are fairly clear now.
Socrates: "Good is That at which all things aim, If one knows what the good is, one will always do what is good." Brian: "Romanes eunt domus"
GW 2013: "and juistin bieber is gay with me and we have 10 kids we live in u.s.a in the white house with obama"Comment
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Ok, that's it. I was already pretty skeptical about you, but this one convinced me that you are certifiable. I cannot take you seriously." Hillary is an evil *****, the same type of person like Carly Fiorina of HP"
Yes, but she's hot!!!
As some people have mentioned (before the Austia v. US ****fest), there were more than one reason for this war. There were many reasons, and WMD was the one picked as most likely to get UN (and US popular) support. I'm irritated that the Bushies hammered away at that "reason" so hard, because now whatever shreds of international credibility we had are toast (well, I'm irritated about a lot of things regarding this war, but I'm trying to keep this short). But I think there is still hope for the outcome. It's still early - the occupation, I mean - and good can still come of this. I'm skeptical, and not particularly impressed so far, but I remain hopeful that Iraq will emerge from this better off.
-Arriangrog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!
The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.Comment
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before the Austia v. US ****fest
you have to hand it to HershOstropoler - his bitter and irrational lambasting and scapegoting on the US almost distracted me from seeing how pointless and irrelevant Austria is
"I bet Ikarus eats his own spunk..."
- BLACKENED from America's Army: Operations
Kramerman - Creator and Author of The Epic Tale of Navalon in the Civ III Stories ForumComment
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Next round, my detraction shall succeed!“Now we declare… that the law-making power or the first and real effective source of law is the people or the body of citizens or the prevailing part of the people according to its election or its will expressed in general convention by vote, commanding or deciding that something be done or omitted in regard to human civil acts under penalty or temporal punishment….” (Marsilius of Padua, „Defensor Pacis“, AD 1324)Comment
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Local custom among friends of the same gender (opposite gender you'd never do it), but you can see how comfortable Bush feels.Originally posted by HershOstropoler
I also wonder whether the next Bush war is against Saudi Arabia. Those gay "divorces" can be nasty.
One of the funniest stories I heard out of GW I was about Schwarzkopf and Khalid bin Sultan, his Saudi counterpart and commander of the Joint Forces Command (basically all the arab forces). Both were big - Schwarzkopf, 6'-3' and around 240 lbs, bin Sultan about the same. Schwarzkopf was an O-10, bin Sultan and O-9, and they used to hold hands around their HQ in Riyadh.
I can just imagine how much it must have hurt the enlisted pukes and lower level officers to see these guys holding hands around HQ, and you couldn't snicker, smirk, or even show any reaction that you noticed without getting your ass skinned alive.
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."Comment
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Yeah, a lot of them would get their asses killed if we stopped dancing around them and started treating them as hostile combatants.Originally posted by Victor Galis
-You've crushed the Iraqi army more or less, but there is still the populace. It could get really ugly if they decided to rise up.
I have. At least semi-functional government is on it's way - whether or not it's fast enough for some people's tastes, that is slowly coming together, as is a resumption of oil production and other economic activity.-Not yet. Anarchy still reigns. It's not as bad as in the first few days, but it's quite obvious from news reports that Iraq still lacks a functional government. If you think that's better than having a repressive government, you haven't considered the implications thereof.
Continuation of Saddam's regime meant ongoing plunder, repression, murder, torture, and sanctions.When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."Comment
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The Bushies have just moved Iraqi self governance to an open future date. The problem is, even if Iraq is better off, I don't think the Iraqis will be happy with that. Continued US occupation, no matter how benevolent (and there's some big IFs in that), will be a problem in itself.Originally posted by Arrian
It's still early - the occupation, I mean - and good can still come of this. I'm skeptical, and not particularly impressed so far, but I remain hopeful that Iraq will emerge from this better off.
“Now we declare… that the law-making power or the first and real effective source of law is the people or the body of citizens or the prevailing part of the people according to its election or its will expressed in general convention by vote, commanding or deciding that something be done or omitted in regard to human civil acts under penalty or temporal punishment….” (Marsilius of Padua, „Defensor Pacis“, AD 1324)Comment
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It's a delicate thing, Hersh, I know. But I'm sticking with "it's early" because, well, it is. Let's wait 'n see before deciding it's a huge failure, eh?
-Arriangrog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!
The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.Comment
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The problem is that the US is starting with little sympathy and credibility, so it was either get it right from the beginning or fail. Every little mistakes costs a lot to repair, if at all possible.
There have been so many screwups already - even "early" can be "too late". But well, I still give it the 1 % chance to succeed.“Now we declare… that the law-making power or the first and real effective source of law is the people or the body of citizens or the prevailing part of the people according to its election or its will expressed in general convention by vote, commanding or deciding that something be done or omitted in regard to human civil acts under penalty or temporal punishment….” (Marsilius of Padua, „Defensor Pacis“, AD 1324)Comment
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How generous & optimistic of you, Hersh! I'm touched.
-Arriangrog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!
The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.Comment
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Yes, I'm an optimist at heart.“Now we declare… that the law-making power or the first and real effective source of law is the people or the body of citizens or the prevailing part of the people according to its election or its will expressed in general convention by vote, commanding or deciding that something be done or omitted in regard to human civil acts under penalty or temporal punishment….” (Marsilius of Padua, „Defensor Pacis“, AD 1324)Comment
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That's damned un-American and unpatriotic of you.Originally posted by HershOstropoler
There have been so many screwups already - even "early" can be "too late". But well, I still give it the 1 % chance to succeed. I give it 2-3% myself. 
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."Comment
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Oh c'mon, if we get a new admin in next year I give it 20%Comment
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