Affirmative action: Reverse racism or concessions for past atrocities?

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
A disproportionate number of minority students (excepting Asians) don't finish school.

Aren't you pointing out another problem with the system as it stands: allowing students into schools they aren't prepared for?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Because racism is a seperate effect.

So? Then make the admissions process race-blind. Simply don't ask it.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Aren't you pointing out another problem with the system as it stands: allowing students into schools they aren't prepared for?

Correlation doesn't equal causality. I knew a couple of students who dropped out because they couldn't put up with the racism in the school. I'm sure there are people who got a hand up who couldn't handle it, but there are a lot more people who got an opportunity to succeed that they wouldn't have had without AA.

It's hardly a perfect system, but until society is ready to make the effort to really fix minority schools, it's all we got.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

Because racism is a seperate effect.

So? Then make the admissions process race-blind. Simply don't ask it.

The prior effects of racism will still be in the system. Discrimination has a proven effect on test scores. If you ignore this, then you let people who are discriminated fall through the cracks.

Racism + economic problems is harder to face than either by itself. They are seperate (though frequently related) problems.

[Kirnwaffen]

The prior effects of racism will still be in the system.

What effect could you possibly be talking about? If the admissions board has no knowledge of your race, what effect could it possibly have?

[Imran Siddiqui]

The prior effects of racism will still be in the system. Discrimination has a proven effect on test scores.

Then deal with it at the lower levels of education, and if there are problems due to poverty give a boost based on poverty levels. As minorities get better primary education, they will start doing much better on the tests. Fixing racism by more (albeit different) racism isn't a valid solution, IMO.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

The prior effects of racism will still be in the system. Discrimination has a proven effect on test scores.

Then deal with it at the lower levels of education,

But this isn't happening!!!!! If they would do it, then we could let AA for education go by the wayside.

Kirnwaffen, try reading the whole post.

[Imran Siddiqui]

But this isn't happening!!!!!

Then make it happen. Poor white kids shouldn't be denied oppertunities they should have simply because they were born white.

[Kirnwaffen]

Reread the post and realized what you were talking about. You do realize that the admissions board will look at more than test scores. Things like grades, community service, essays. Their are ways to make yourself attractive to schools other than good SATs.

edited for grammar.

[Shi Huangdi]

"I knew a couple of students who dropped out because they couldn't put up with the racism in the school. "

If they can't deal with racism in school, how are they going to deal with racism, or any other sort of nastiness out there? College is if anything a less racist environment then real world. Personally, I've yet to meet a racist student or teacher.

Use common sense. If someone who is admitted to school with lower academic qualifications then the student body in general, isn't it more likely they won't do as well? Now, some people do become better students in college then they were in HS, but I would think on a whole the same students who were good in HS would be likely to also be in college.

In any case, I really don't find an unwelcoming environment a good excuse for poor academic performance or dropping out. At the High School Level, there are some kids who are out victimized and target for every sort of nastiness imaginable, but they don't drop out and often times these kids do better academically then the population as a whole?

"There were only a handful of African-Americans in mainstream institutions of higher learning 40 years ago. Some were admitted but most could not attend due to past depravation of educational opportunity and lack of financial resources. The affect of "legacies" is tremendously skewed in favor of whites."

But not all white have legacies, and if you give advantages to the whites with legacies and then the minorites with AA, you are leaving behind the impoverished white. Economics is by far the most important variable here, racism is not.

[orange]

The white Frats are more likely to be connected to business, so they have an advantage. When you consider the number of white Frats and Sororities that exclude blacks (especially in the South) it becomes a noteworthy factor.

There are all black frats as well, not to mention all homosexual frats. In most places it's pretty difficult to get away with an "all white frat", not that I support those, or any frats that are exlusive (though technically all are, because they don't allow women)

[TOUGHUSAGUY]

THE NEGORES DONT UNDERSTAND THAT SLAVERY WAS IN MANY WAYS GOOD FOR THEM - FREE EDUCATION AND GOING TO A SUPER RICH COUNTRY WHERE THEY WOULD BE MUCH MORE RICHER THEN IF THEY STILL BE IN AFRICA!


OF COURSE NO TO THE AFFIRMATIVE ACTION THE STUPID LIBERALS WANT JUST BECAUSE IT!


USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA USA!

[Boris Godunov]

Ok, as much as I enjoy seeing trolls designed to make conservatives look bad, this one is so obvious and uncreative as to be worthless. *Flush*

[Zylka]

EVERYONE WHO WAS THE 50TH INDUCTEE TO THE POLY HALL OF FAME POST BELOW!!!

[Imran Siddiqui]

Ok, who's DL is this... serious .