Ctp Competition Rule Discussion..

[Solver]

Understood... if you say it's only 10-20 minutes, I'm fine with one Settler, 100 gold, too. These are the hardest conditions.

If the game goes into the Genetic age... as long as you can play it out, it should be more fun!

[yoda]

Map

Just looked at the "comp2" map for the first time. In general, I like this map. Lots of different choices to make for expansion. Lot's of production ground.

My only comment would be about the goods. In my opinion, there are FAR too many. Quadruple goods? Please JBYTheWay, don't take this wrong or personal. The amount of effort you put into this map is amazing. Congratulations.

Now to the problem about the goods. With that many goods, WAR is not an option. The game will be heavily balanced towards the space race. Why? Science will advance so fast that by the time anyone tries to mount any kind of offensive, their units will be obsolete. After quickly looking at the map, it is my estimate that I will be learning modern age tech at a rate of 1 per every 3 turns. That means by the time a person gets to Marines (assuming both players are equal), it will only be about 13 turns before nukes arrive and another 3 turns before interceptors are around. Just how many marines/transports with supporting ships do you think you could get before they become radioactive dust? Furthuremore, any attempt at an early invasion with Ren. Age tech would meet a similar end because modern age would come up so rapidly.

On the other hand, having science advance so rapidly would mean that quick hit and run tactics with small strike forces would be very effective. Space planes/fighers would become very critical as well as interceptor/paratroopers. However, the concept of a huge military campaign is just not viable in my opinion.

If we do play with this map (and I think it is good enough to use...), perhaps the removal of the quadruples and thinning out the goods a bit would work. But that is up to everyone. I don't mind a good science race as long as everyone else likes that type of game.

yoda

[J Bytheway]

Well... I put fewer goods on my first map and there were complaints about that, so I added more this time around. Adding and/or removing them is easy, and if you can get a consensus opinion (how likely is that... ) then I'll happily change it. At this rate you're just going to have to either poll everyone on every issue or else just get solver to declare (and it's obvious which would be quicker).

It's like the time factor. Before there were complaints that the game would be quick and dirty, now that it will take forever... That happy middle ground is hard to hit.

[Gavrushka]

I don't care how many goods you delete.... as long as it is from my opponents side of the map....

But yeh Valid point...

[Solver]

Argh, I was hoping we're finally agreed . I wanted to start the first game this Friday, maybe. Suckers . Well, if you can't live with this many goods, change it, otherwise, let's get to play.

[J Bytheway]

I think quinns is right - you're all just making conjectures at the moment, when someone actually plays a test game you'll have concrete evidence to get your teeth into. So play! Play! I ain't changing anything until someone plays a game and tests this out.

[Gavrushka]

Okay everyone give the map a try online this weekend - ALL report our findings and start next week - Simple as that eh?

[Gavrushka]

Yoda- sorry you have started a game with Kansas... I worked later than expected, my apologies.

[quinns]

Okay Gavrushka. So it's you vs. me on the comp3 scenario right? Saturday sometime? ** Note that the COMP3 scenario (above) is J-Bytheway's COMP2 map with 3 settlers and a river running through the settler's starting position. See above.

If we do the test, I think we should all use the same scenario as attached above (i.e. the COMP3 scenario). If you don't know how to set up the scenario on your computer, see an earlier thread by Quinns about this set up. (Yoda, I think you can get your map to work as well using these instructions.)


From page 2 of this same thread...

"You just have to copy the files to your C: drive exactly as described there. In the example, I set up the sym4way_c.csg map. You can exchange the map, but you have to open the new map in cheat mode, then "Save Scenario As" and remember what you name it. You have to change the SCENARIO.TXT file in line one to match this name exactly. Right now, that name is "sym4way_c". Also, you have to copy over the savegame.csg file with whatever file you saved it to when you "Saved Scenario As". That is, go to the C:\Program Files\Activision\Civilization-Call To Power\ctp_program\ctp\save\games\Sennac (for example), change the file name there to "savegame.csg" and overwrite the file under the C:\Program Files\Activision\Civilization-Call To Power\scenarios\MyScenarioPack\scen0000 folder called savegame.csg. I'm sure you all will figure it out. See attached files for assistance. Good luck."


Also refer to the thread discussion about the CTP Competition MAP to see details on how to set up the scenario to run any custom map in an on line scenario.

[Gavrushka]

Erm don't you just need to have it - I tried it - but the instructions you posted were in a later version of word then I have .... (word 7.0 for 95... )

[quinns]

Right Gavrushka. I will start up our game. The post was meant for anyone else who wants to test the comp3 scenario this weekend.

[yoda]

Quinns Map

I think we should vote on the "extra river" for the comp2 map. Personally, I don't mind if is not added as the game becomes significantly easier with the extra river. Also, Quinns map (comp3) has some errors in it. Blue has an extra 3 hex river with a forest hex and the beach is not quite right. If we do end up using this map with the extra river, could JBYTHEWAY make the adjustments as the "official map creator"?

yoda

[yoda]

goods

I just played a hotseat game to test quinns map. With the extra river and all the goods (and three settlers), by 1300bc I was almost at democracy. And that was with only 2 trade routes and not really trying very hard to get the science going. I think my science was somewhere around 600 at the time.

So, just to make the point again, if the map is played as is (with the extra river and all those goods), you can count on being into modern age before 0AD and that the game with almost certainly be all about the science race to space.

yoda

[J Bytheway]

Ouch! I didn't realize it would be quite that bad! How many cities did you have at this point?

[yoda]

cities

Originally posted by J Bytheway
Ouch! I didn't realize it would be quite that bad! How many cities did you have at this point?

I think I had 30+ at that point. Remember thought, that is with the extra river and starting with 3 settlers.