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  • Foreign Intelligence Datalinks

    Overview


    Team civ tech1 tech2 UU replaces leader trait1 trait2
    Mercenary German hunting mining tank (28) Frederick philosophical creative
    Vox Russian hunting mining cavalry (15->18) Catherina creative financial
    Banana French farming the wheel musketman (9) Louis industrious creative
    Gathering Storm Malinese the wheel mining archer (3->4) Mansa Musa spiritual financial
    Horde Mongols hunting the wheel horse archer (6) Kublai Khan agressive creative
    AC Chinese farming mining crossbow (6) Qin industrious financial
    Sarantium English fishing mining rifleman (14->16) Elizabeth philosophical financial


    All years here are the years we see the events happening in our turn. This means Sarantium's events all happened 1 year earlier in reality (might be important for events tagged with a year next to them). Also, end-of-turn events for our team are added to the current year. So, if we discover a tech or our city grows when we hit "end turn", it's still listed for that year (because that's the way we see it for other teams too).

    One important remark here is about the "land"-score of a team. The score is added at the beginning of the 20th year after you acquired some land. So, for example for Sarantium, if they build a city in 3960 BC (for them), we see the population increase in the score list when the turn gets back to us (in 3920 BC) and the city-building event is listed here in the year 3920 BC. The land acquiring score however, gets added for each team at the same time (when the year advances). So, we see their land increasing score in the year 3160 BC (where 3120 BC would be the more logical year). This means, for Sarantium only, there are 19 years between actual border expansion and their score update. For all other teams, there's 20 years between those events.

    I included all info here based on scores, religions founded and population info in the F9 screen. If somebody knows yet another way to find information, post it here too.

    up-to-date till turn 82 : 850 BC


    Well, seems like I broke the 20000 character limit, so scroll down and I'll have one post for each team
    Mercs and Vox are at the bottom of this page, the other 5 teams are at the top of the next page.


    Graphs


    _______score_______________gold_______ ________goods_______________crop______ ________power_____________culture_______
    Last edited by PJayTycy; May 11, 2007, 18:21.
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  • #2
    bumped

    -> added data from turn 3160 BC
    -> added scores and score differences (will make it easier to update)
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    • #3
      Nit: Louis is not Org/Cre
      "Cutlery confused Stalin"
      -BBC news

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      • #4
        thanks CT, corrected that
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        • #5
          It's probably interesting to list here how to get this info out of the team scores, power graphs, GNP graphs etc...:

          score


          => Score has 4 parts : population, land, technology and wonders.
          Population score = 5000/841 * [population] (~ 5.95 * ...)
          Land score = 2000/1064 * [land owned for 20+ turns] (~ 1.88 * ...)
          Tech score = 2000/301 * [techs valued by era] (~ 6.64 * ...)
          Wonder score = 1000/46 * [number of wonders] (~ 21.74 * ...)

          These parts are all rounded DOWN and then added up for a final score. A population increase will either give +5 or (mostly) +6 points. A new tech will either give +6 or +7 points. Wonder and Land scores can be seen more easy.


          power graphs


          An other source of info is the power graph (and the "soldiers" info in the demographics tab, which is power*1000).

          => Power has 4 parts : population, techs, buildings and units
          Population power = [population] / 2 (rounded DOWN)

          Building power:
          • 2 = walls, castle, drydock, forge, factory
          • 4 = barracks, iron works, mt. Rushmore, red cross
          • 8 = heroic epic, west point, scotland yard, chichen itza

          Tech power:
          • 2 = sailing, hunting, mining, animal husbandry
          • 4 = the wheel, alphabet, astronomy, metal casting, compass, construction, steel, radio, satellites
          • 6 = mathematics, chemistry, combustion, archery
          • 8 = fission, flight, bronze working, machinery, assembly line, guilds
          • 10 = horseback riding, iron working, artillery, industrialism, rocketry
          • 12 = gunpowder, rifling

          Unit power:
          • 1 = warrior
          • 2 = axeman, spearman, archer, chariot, galley
          • 3 = swordsman, Mali skirmisher (Gathering Storm), horse archer, catapult, caravel
          • 4 = pikeman, longbowman, crossbowman, Mongol Keshik (Horde), war elephant, galleon
          • 5 = maceman, China Chokonu (Alpha Centauri)
          • 6 = musketman, knight, frigate, ironclad, transport
          • 8 = French musketeer (Banana), cannon, destroyer, submarine
          • 10 = rifleman, grenadier, machine gun, carrier
          • 12 = English redcoat (Sarantium), cavalry, battleship
          • 15 = Russian Cossack (Vox), fighter, jet fighter, bomber
          • 16 = infantry
          • 18 = marine
          • 20 = SAM infantry, gunship, artillery, stealth bomber
          • 25 = tank
          • 30 = mechanized infantry, German panzer (Mercenaries)
          • 40 = modern armor, ICBM


          GNP (gold production)


          In the early game, one can assume everybody will be running 100% research allocation. The research breakers / turn is then equal to : (GNP) * modifier + 1.
          The modifier depends on how many teams you can trade with and already have that tech (before tech trading = 0) and the number of OR-paths you already researched:
          modifier = 100% + 30% * (teams known to have the tech) / (teams alive) + 20% * (number of OR-prerequisites known).
          For example, researching animal husbandry with 1 prerequisite known (agriculture) and 11 research points per turn in the city view, gives this actual tech rate: 1 + (100 % + 20%) * 11 = 14 / turn. Researching animal husbandry with 2 prerequisites known (agriculture, hunting), gives this actual tech rate : 1 + (100% + 40%) * 11 = 16 / turn.
          Last edited by PJayTycy; June 25, 2006, 18:55.
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          • #6
            bump
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            • #7
              Wow, tis is cool. PJayTycy, wery nice work!
              I'll read it thoroughly later and if you don't have time to continue, you should open me your secrets, so that I can go on.
              Also, we should be basing some conclusions on this (guess techs by research times, etc). .
              -- What history has taught us is that people do not learn from history.
              -- Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by binTravkin
                Wow, tis is cool. PJayTycy, wery nice work!
                I'll read it thoroughly later and if you don't have time to continue, you should open me your secrets, so that I can go on.
                All the info I use is in post #5 here. (I got it from the SDK source code and xml files)

                The only other thing I use is an excell file where I can modify the tech/pop/land/wonder scores and see what the result is. So, if somebody goes up 6 points, I try with increasing population and with increasing tech. If only one of them has the right outcome, it's done. If they both have the right outcome, you can look at the world population in the demographics info window. Ofcourse there are still situations where it might not be completely sure what happened, but we didn't encounter any of those yet.

                I attached the excel file to this post (current to turn 2640 BC).
                Attached Files
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                • #9
                  In otherwords you made a pivot table for CIV.

                  Or is it just a simple 2D spreadsheet.
                  Last edited by ForesterSOF; August 25, 2006, 07:02.
                  You have two choices in life; Explore and learn or Vegetate.
                  There is a reason for everything.

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                  • #10
                    OK, I discovered an other mistake with the Mercenaries foreign intelligence:

                    In 3120 BC, they got +22 points. I accounted all of them under "land ownership" for the year 3920 BC, but that was wrong. They only acquired 9 tiles, which is 16 points. The other 6 points were due to population growth. As a result their following population growth / tech discovery events were also possibly wrong.

                    In any case, their history record is now a lot more "normal" (ie: they are not lacking with 1 pop for the whole game, their tech discoveries have more reasonable research times, ...)

                    Wrong Old Info
                    Wrong Old Info
                    ====== : 0006 : +006 : tech discovered : 1 tech : hunting
                    ====== : 0013 : +007 : tech discovered : 2 tech : mining
                    ====== : ---- : ---- : 1 scout
                    4000 BC : 0039 : +026 : capital founded (+ 1 pop, + 1 wonder)
                    3520 BC : 0045 : +006 : tech discovered : 3 tech : ? (? in 12 turns)
                    3240 BC : 0052 : +007 : tech discovered : 4 tech : ? (? in 7 turns)
                    3200 BC : 0067 : +015 : land ownership : 8 land (+8)
                    3120 BC : 0089 : +022 : land ownership : 20 land (+12)
                    2840 BC : 0096 : +007 : tech discovered : 5 tech : ? (? in 9 turns)
                    2520 BC : 0102 : +006 : population growth : 2 pop (22 in 37 turns)
                    2480 BC : 0108 : +006 : city 2 founded : 2+1 pop
                    2440 BC : 0114 : +006 : population growth : 3+1 pop (24 in 2 turns)
                    New, Hopefully Correct Info
                    New, Hopefully Correct Info

                    ====== : 0006 : +006 : tech discovered : 1 tech : hunting
                    ====== : 0013 : +007 : tech discovered : 2 tech : mining
                    ====== : ---- : ---- : 1 scout
                    4000 BC : 0039 : +026 : capital founded (+ 1 pop, + 1 wonder)
                    3520 BC : 0045 : +006 : tech discovered : 3 tech : ? (? in 12 turns)
                    3240 BC : 0052 : +007 : tech discovered : 4 tech : ? (? in 7 turns)
                    3200 BC : 0067 : +015 : land ownership : 8 land (+8)
                    3120 BC : 0083 : +016 : land ownership : 17 land (+9)
                    ====== : 0089 : +006 : population growth : 2 pop (22 in 22 turns)

                    2840 BC : 0096 : +007 : tech discovered : 5 tech : ? (? in 9 turns)
                    2520 BC : 0102 : +006 : tech discovered : 6 tech : ? (? in 8 turns)
                    2480 BC : 0108 : +006 : city 2 founded : 2+1 pop
                    2440 BC : 0114 : +006 : population growth : 3+1 pop (24 in 17 turns)

                    This error of mine voids our guessing as to them having a very food-rich start. They likely had a low-food start.

                    This also means the mercs are probably NOT landlocked. They might be sailing the seas already now.
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                    • #11
                      Just a reply to upload the latest version of the excell sheet. I now keep track of the min/avg/max rival scores for territory and population in the demographics window. This was necessary to be able to differentiate between population-growth and territory increases in the different cities.
                      Attached Files
                      Last edited by PJayTycy; October 13, 2006, 12:14.
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                      • #12
                        This might help:

                        http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=163098

                        How the 'soldiers' demographic is worked out.
                        Indifference is Bliss

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                        • #13
                          Re: Foreign Intelligence Datalinks

                          I've hit quote instead of edit and can't delete this post. Sorry

                          Forgiveness come from within
                          Last edited by Lacero; October 25, 2006, 15:09.
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                          • #14
                            No problem as long as you keep us updated with this valuable info
                            -- What history has taught us is that people do not learn from history.
                            -- Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

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                            • #15
                              By examining the health and life expectancy demographics, I've been able to get an idea of our rivals' starting positions. Not all of the numbers from the game match the numbers I've estimated, thanks to the ambiguity introduced by truncating demographics to two decimal places and random events like forest growth, but most of what I've found should be accurate.

                              All civs except Gathering Storm started with 6 health, due to some combination of fresh water and forests. All civs except Gathering Storm started with just 1 unhealth, meaning none of them have more than 2 flood plains tiles (at .4 unhealth per flood plain), or a concentration of jungle. Gathering Storm started with 7 health and 3 unhealth.

                              On -3440, the Bananas gained a point of health, presumably due to forest growth.

                              Sarantium grew on -2960, rather than -2880. This means their tech discovery would have been on -2880 instead of -2960.

                              On -2520, someone lost health or gained unhealth on a turn when no one gained population. At this early date, most of the ways for this to happen are impossible, leaving an early chop or jungle growth as the most likely possibilities.

                              On -2480, the Mercs founded a city with the base amount of happiness (4) and 6 health.

                              The Bananas founded their city in -2280 somewhere that gives the city 4 health (2 from difficulty level and 2 more from something) and 5 happiness (4 from difficulty level and 1 more from a resource not connected to the capital).
                              I can't find a site like that in our explored territory or the screenshot they sent us a while back. It's possible forest grew near the silver in the northeast.

                              Here's the spreadsheet where I collected all this data, if anyone else wants to play with it. These demographics will become less useful as populations grow, since I'm already unable to see some changes in health and happiness, thanks to the two-digit truncation.
                              Attached Files
                              Last edited by Chaos Theory; November 4, 2006, 21:34.
                              "Cutlery confused Stalin"
                              -BBC news

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