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a few observations on leader generation

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  • a few observations on leader generation

    I have been playing mostly non-militaristic civilizations (Greeks, Persians, Indians, French etc.) so these observations may be different for militaristic civs, when I played the Germans I was getting a lot of leaders, and I thought it was commonplace, so I didn't pay much attention to the specifics of the situations.

    I am not entirely sure about any of this info, these are trends from my realtively small sample size, feel free to add experiances they will likely be helpful for us all, case-studies if you will.

    *it seems that leaders are more likely to be created in close battles
    meaning, my unit loses more damage points and the battle is realtively close. I have never gotten a leader from a perfect (my unit keeps 5 points) battle.

    *f your unit faces a strong unit it seems more likely to make a leader
    so, if your horsemen beats a pikeman that appears more likely to create a leader than if your tank beats said pikeman.

    I haven't paid much attention to this but ow does the initial dattus of the opposing unit factor in. If you beat an elite or veteran unit, is that more likely to produce a leader than beating a normal 3 damage or a conscrpit? I think it is likely....

    what are your guys expiriances? are these general observations decent?

  • #2
    I don't have any hard data, but your observations seem to be correct. My last game (as the Greeks, Monarch, standard map, 8 civs, archipeligo) I got 3 leaders (all late the first was in 1420 or so). All appeared after a close fought battle (all were against infantry in cities). None appeared after any of my many victories with tanks against archers.
    Libraries are state sanctioned, so they're technically engaged in privateering. - Felch
    I thought we're trying to have a serious discussion? It says serious in the thread title!- Al. B. Sure

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    • #3
      Re: a few observations on leader generation

      Originally posted by Mr. T
      *f your unit faces a strong unit it seems more likely to make a leader
      so, if your horsemen beats a pikeman that appears more likely to create a leader than if your tank beats said pikeman.

      I haven't paid much attention to this but ow does the initial dattus of the opposing unit factor in. If you beat an elite or veteran unit, is that more likely to produce a leader than beating a normal 3 damage or a conscrpit? I think it is likely....

      what are your guys expiriances? are these general observations decent?
      I got 2 leaders when 20 riders & calvarys tries to attack my army of 3 elite modern armor.. I am not playing a militaristic civ tho

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      • #4
        any thoughts on how combat involving armies effects leader production? my original post was about individual units, although you bring up an interesting wrinckle

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        • #5
          I've noticed that the more battles that unit faces THAT TURN, the more likely he is to advance in rank (and possibly to leader). For example, I've noticed this pattern everytime the situation brought it up (keep in mind this is 1 turn): a guy attacks my regular, my regular wins, a guy attacks my regular, regular becomes veteran, a guy attacks my veteran, veteran becomes elite. I'm assuming you can do a similar recreation of this and greatly increase your chances of dishing a leader out.

          Also, I heard someone say once that capturing a capitol gives you a leader. My experiences say otherwise. Anyone have any comments on this?

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          • #6
            On a several "warm-up" games played out until about 1000 A.D., I noticed that I would get about 2 leaders total, often using militaristic civs on high levels. Now playing Egypt, I am well into the 1600s and I have not seen even one leader. I do recall two specific times where I attacked a stronger unit with an already damaged unit of my own and that did it.

            If only elites can get leaders, and militaristic civs advance unit ranks faster, and leaders produce wonders, I think I wanna restart my game....

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            • #7
              Ive crushed many an enemy capital, and no Great Leader appeared to greet my weary armies...

              On the other hand, i HAVE generated GLs from tank battles. I was fighting against Infantry or Riflemen at the time though.
              I'm building a wagon! On some other part of the internets, obviously (but not that other site).

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              • #8
                russians and germans give me leaders. late greeks too, in some massive tank battles. however, i got absolutely none of them with babs (whole game) and indians. since indians are currently in some massive world war....it can happen. btw...naval units cannot get you a leader, right?

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                • #9
                  Hmm yes it is very likely that tough battles will produce more leader
                  atleast my last game with the americans suggests this. This was on
                  monarch difficulty doing my best to defend Leeds form hordes of aztec
                  swordsman and longbowman. That town produced 3 great leaders
                  in 5 turns...

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                  • #10
                    If only elites can get leaders, and militaristic civs advance unit ranks faster, and leaders produce wonders, I think I wanna restart my game....
                    Yes, only elites can produce leaders.

                    Some of you say that you have got leaders after defending. This has never happened to me - all my leaders (as well as all enemy leaders) have shown up after a successful *attack*. Of course. this i probably just coincidence. since you will use elites for attacking more than defending.

                    Someone mentioned (in another thread) that there is a 1/16 chance of producing a leader. Any facts to prove this?

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                    • #11
                      I believe the stat quoted (from the properties file) was that it was about 1/16 without the army-improving wonder (I forget which it is), and then 1/12 with it, with numbers a little better for the Militarist Civs.

                      Contrary to what I've been reading, I've found almost all my leaders were generated fairly early (say, late middle ages), but this tends to be when there are closer battles. In the modern age, you are often either way ahead or way behind.

                      In my current game on Monarch, I launched several half-assed assaults on opp cities with superior, but too few, units. These were done in by a combination of typically bad luck on my cannon bombardment, atypically bad luck on head-2-head, and really bad strategy by me splitting and resplitting until I needed to depend on say 4 or 5 cav taking out 2 rifle defenders (possible, but not something you want to depend upon, esp. when the rifle are behind city walls). I got creamed, but when I finally got around in a few turns to taking those cities, damn near every one had someone popped out a leader (and then, inexplicably, not cashed them in).

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by LaRusso
                        btw...naval units cannot get you a leader, right?
                        I beleive someone on this board posted that they got a leader after winning with an elite battleship (John Paul Jones of the Americans). No common, but possible.

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                        • #13
                          Well, I have had plenty of leaders so far, but I have noticed one thing; I don't think you can have more than one leader at a time. In my game, I decided the time was ripe to kill everyone (ie, I discovered synth fibres, and no one else had ecology yet....).

                          One of my first combats netted me a leader. I kept that leader for the rest of the game, and never made another. This was after destroying three civilizations completely (and yes, I always make optimal use of elite units).

                          I have never gotten a defensive leader, but apparently, from this thread, they do happen. =]

                          I DO get leaders from battles that aren't close (ie, still at 5 pts, and get a leader), and also from beating on weaker enemies (my modern armour hit a spearman and gave me a leader).

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                          • #14
                            You can definitely have more than one leader at a time. I have had upto three at once and I have seen the AI (Russians) have five at once, including three created in the same turn.

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                            • #15
                              Capitals and Leaders

                              I had two leaders created when I took 2 enemy capitals (the first time I took each one's capital). Most likely it is just coincidence, but I now make sure that an Elite unit is the one to defeat the last defender and enter the capital (just in case).

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