PTW Patch 1.04f!!

[Dis]

edit: wrong thread

[WarpStorm]

Originally posted by Big Dave
I have to agree to a stinking EULA

Can you name a piece of commercial software in the past 5 years that didn't have a EULA?

[Big Dave]

Since I run alot of M$ software I am familliar with EULA's, just this is the first one I have had to agree to in order to d/l a patch. And I'm getting spoiled by Linux. No EULA for the OS, nor for most of the software. Oh, wait, all that's been written in the past 5 years!

[WarpStorm]

Sorry, Dave, Linux has license agreements. They just don't use the acronym EULA. In fact a lot of it is under GPL, which can be a serious concern if you are trying to make money from your software.

[ThePlagueRat]

Hey, there is a slight difference here warpstorm...

Open Source archives can be compiled by yourself,
after you perhaps modified the code.
And you can download other's code.
If you do so, you'll risk your own bugs (or theirs) of course...

If you download official patches for something you paid for
(i.e PTW) you will risk just the same bugs from Firaxis.
They can't guarantee quality.

Just like many others there is no QA in this software.
(Activision and Firaxis being the worst in their league)

Perhaps they were lucky with the creation of Alpha Centauri?
No serious bugs, that I can remember...
And a terrific good design! (and correct implementation/ runtime)

[Panag]

hi ,

HéY Firaxis , when is the new patch going to be out , ......?

still to many troubles

and get those guys from infogreed to do something for there money , you still cant find PTW around the corner , no pr , next to nothing in some parts of europe , wake them up !

when you have 1000 units PTW is running soooo slow , could some-one please fix this !

have a nice day

[Billster2k3]

Originally posted by planetfall

If you want to complain about EULA's, complain about the new MS licensing scheme where locked into a set computer where MS has all your build/configuration information.

This is way off-thread so I'll be brief but I feel compelled to respond. As a software trainer for a major OEM pc-maker I went to a 40-hr class on WinXP at MS and one of the things we learned was how the product activation works. Technically planetfall, you are correct. They do, to a degree, have your system config info. There is a string sent that contains your network card's MAC address, CPU/RAM/HDD size, etc. This string is stored with the CD-Key on your COA. No personal information whatsoever is sent. Therefore, unless you submit the VOLUNTARY registration (an entirely separate process from activation), they have no idea who you are and all they do have is a database that says that, somewhere in North America, a system with "X" HW components has the Windows with "X" CD-Key. That way when you try to activate the same CD-Key on different hardware (another pc in other words) it comes back and says, "sorry, no can do." Maybe I am weird but I have no problem with a company taking measures to keep people from stealing its products.

But then again, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

[ThePlagueRat]

So, if you buy a new network interface card (cheap) you'll get a new MAC, and M$ gets a
new identifier. But does it help?

[Billster2k3]

Actually, there is a catch there. The MAC is one of the highest scaled components so changing your NIC will probably force you to have to reactivate by calling MS and saying, "hey I replaced my NIC so I need to reactivate." Memory, sound card, video card, etc. are much lower on the scale so adding RAM or upgrading your video card will probably not force reactivation but doing both might. The thing here folks, is that the people who man the phones at the activation line have been instructed to be very lenient about allowing you to reactivate as long as you have a reasonable explaination as to why your config has changed. Is it a bit of a hassle? Yes. Is it absolutely unreasonable? I, personally, don't think so. The Microsoft Corporation estimates that it loses about $30,000,000,000 per year to piracy. That's real money even for them. They openly state that they know they will never stop hardcore professional software piracy, what they are looking to stop is casual piracy (Bob buys a copy of WinXp and thinks it's pretty cool so he installs it on his wife's pc and burns a copy for his neighbor and a buddy at work. Bob has just committed 3 acts of piracy (probably unwittingly) and cost MS $600. The new activation policy stops that). Again, I apologize for going off-thread but most of us use MS products and this is a controversial topic that I think it is important for folks to understand. In order to not tie up this thread with MS Product Activation stuff, if you have specific questions on it feel free to e-mail me at wmflorey@mindspring.com. Microsoft also has a very thourough FAQ on product activation at http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;302878

[WarpStorm]

I was wrong, Linux does have a EULA.

[planetfall]

Originally posted by Billster2k3

This is way off-thread so I'll be brief but I feel compelled to respond.

Bill,

My points were:

1. Don't complain about Firaxis asking for EULA confirmation when all they are doing is following the lead of the largest software company, M$.

2. EULA's and locking licenses to 1 system are legitimate methods to block piracy.

3. Transmitting usage data back to vendor should be beyond the scope of any EULA. We should have to right not to transmit data back to MS if we so desire. The only data I would find of value to transmit back would be the versions/patch levels of software if I am participating in a plan to automatically upgrade software as new releases come out. I do not expect data of which CD roms are playing to be any of MS concern, period.

4. Firaxis is a smaller company. Unless you are willing to pay substantially more for your games, don't expect their level of quality pre-release to be much different than the software industry.

5. This whole discussion about EULA is a red herring. The discussion should be about patch 1.04 and it's impact. If as a group we don't identify the major problems we have with Firaxis software, then never expect improvements.


== PF

[WarpStorm]

Originally posted by planetfall
5. This whole discussion about EULA is a red herring. The discussion should be about patch 1.04 and it's impact. If as a group we don't identify the major problems we have with Firaxis software, then never expect improvements.

Good point

[Billster2k3]

planetfall, in response to your points:

1: I agree
2: I agree, but Microsoft obviously doesn't (which is their right)
3: I agree to that also but again, no personal info is sent. Neither is what CD you may have in your drive. It is just basic system config info at time of activation so I don't find it overly intrusive.
4: I agree
5: I wholeheartedly agree! I just felt a need to set the record straight so we could move past it and continue the discussion at hand.

So, to get back on track....I agree with those who have pointed out that it seems that the good people at Firaxis are doing the best they can....I haven't had the guts to try MP yet (I have a ways to go to master the singleplayer game before I let you guys start beating up on me) but I love the PTW enhancements to the single-player game and the patch has definitely squared away some minor bugs. I would much rather have PTW now and have to wait for patches for some elements of the game than have to wait until 2003 to get any of the PTW features. Imagine if we had had to wait until 1.29f came out to get our hands on Civ3. I don't know about you all but I have enjoyed countless hours of civ'ing ever since I opened the box last year and I would hate to have lost that by having to wait until the game was "perfect" to get to start playing it.

[Switch]

Originally posted by Big Dave
I have to agree to a stinking EULA before I can d/l a patch to something that should be a patch itself!?!?!?!!?!!?!!?



Have a nice life, Firaxis-Infogreed et. al.

Oh NO! You have to press a button that says "I Agree". Whatever will you do? Your life is ruined, Firaxis has destroyed your entire gaming experience! Why, oh why did they have to implement a EULA that makes zero impact on anything you do?

Really, is that the best you can come up with? A complaint about a EULA?

[Coracle]

Originally posted by zulu9812
Am I the only one who who

a) thinks it's really funny that there's a patch before the product is release?

b) is pissed off that Infogrames forced the rush-release of PTW, just like they did with Civ3? Bet that's why we're not getting a goddamned scenario editor!!!!

I don't think it's funny at all.

I haven't been to this site in a month or more, but - SURPRISE! - it looks like Firaxis is up to its same old disreputable tricks again: beta products, patch after inadequate patch, incomplete features.

Hey, life is crappy, but if some of you actually enjoy paying for this stuff, and going through all the aggravation, I'm happy for you. Firaxis is even happier!