Dear god, the auto workers are coming!

[MrFun]

Wow - here is to Markos -- the master of logic!

All your counter-points in your latest post here were very good. Meanwhile, I am eagerly waiting for Civilization III while fixing some problems with my modified Call to Power II.

[Par4]

The micromanagement, please someone think of the micromanagement!!!

I hope there's a unit that comes around later that doesn't use 1 population, in 20th century level countries tens of thousands are people aren't used to create roads...

PWorkers

Vs

Micromanagers

[Jon Miller]

Workers are fun in the beginning. They just can get tedious later on. I would use the AI if it was good enough (more effeicient times wise if not more effienctc game wise).


Woekers are a lot of the fun in the early game.

Jon Miller

[ChrisShaffer]

I'm thrilled to hear that there are worker units. Managing terrain improvements is one of my favorite things about Civ. I can't imagine ever letting the computer control my settlers/formers/workers.

I, for one, am willing to believe that Firaxis is capable of improving the AI's ability to control colonists and workers.

[Lancer]

-what Roman said

Markos, actually I haven't complained about lack of realism in resources, I started a whole thread on it, now in its second edition. Recourses are well covered in my thread, "Making Trade Essential..." Regarding building tanks without factories, I'm on my way to "complain" about that now. Watch for my newest thread, "Manufacturing Capability Should Come Before End Product" which I'm about to manufacture in my threadmill...

As far as factory workers being represented, I have no problem w/ that. I play Colonization now and again and enjoy the hunt for professional workers.

Mr Pleasant,
The "scientist" that designs roads is represented in the game, in your city population. Like most office workers, he doesn't get out much.

If there is to be a change, I think it should be in setting larger tasks for the new worker units. As connerkimbro said, be able tp program the worker to do more than one thing. Lay out the whole road, not just square by square. Perhaps being able to plan on the map every farm, road and mine to be build for the next 10 or 20 turns, and what order they are to be built in would resolve the micromanagement issues while still maintaining unit representation for the guys that get the job done, for the reasons mentioned earlier. Besides Mr Pleasant and his 'workers shouldn't be on the board because scientists aren't', I haven't seen anyone even try to debate my reasoning on why the should be there.
[This message has been edited by Lancer (edited April 08, 2001).]

[Mister Pleasant]

100% Pathfinding? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Even human players aren't perfect at this. Lancer, my point was that the role of workers can be represented by a unit or a PW fund, much as scientists can be represented as specialists or a unit.

[Ilkuul]

quote: Originally posted by Par4 on 04-07-2001 03:09 PM I hope there's a unit that comes around later that doesn't use 1 population, in 20th century level countries tens of thousands are people aren't used to create roads...

A good point. Maybe, for greater realism, the worker unit could cost 1 pop up to a certain city size (12?), after which there would be no pop cost.

Not having played CTP, I'm not familiar with the PW setup; but I do like the idea of being able to automate workers to, for instance, connect cities with roads/railroads, rather than just building them within one city's radius (IF it works better than the automate function in Civ2!).

It would also be very good if workers could be instructed to irrigate/build farmland on a particular type of terrain, e.g. plains or grassland - to avoid the ridiculous situation you have in Civ2 where you can find an automated engineer irrigating a perfectly good and productive forest while there are un-irrigated grassland tiles all around it!

[Zeevico]

What would stop you from building millions and millions of the in one city then? Why not have it that every three workers would take 1 pop point?

[Chronus]

Hi Trachmir,

Well now I see where our thinking is different. I picture a service road leading up to the farm as well, but it's just a dirt (or badly paved) road. Creating a road in the tiles, to me, represents upgrading them to cobblestone (or whatever best reflects the time period), etc., not to mention more of them. Not only that, but as someone mentioned above, it represents a connection to other services WITHIN the city. The key idea here is that "trade" within a city does exist without the need for another city. Example: the lack of a good transportation system could very well affect my decision to see a movie that's on the other side of town. Consequently, the entertainment industry (when looking at this on a wider scale) would be affected. "Ugly" you say. You betcha! But that's how it is in real life, no? The big, wealthy cities have tons of ugly roads stretching out for miles on end, connnecting many miniature sources of trade within (as well as outside) that very city.

This all sidesteps the real issue IMOHO. Simply put, I enjoy aspects of the game that deal with economy and infrastructure. Taking the time to build roads in all my tiles results in a reward: more trade. Shouldn't I reap the benefits for such a task? Removing this bonus eliminates another aspect of infrastructure. One may say, "But it could be replaced with a better idea!" I suppose, but why not just add the idea instead of replacing?

Anyway, enough with my rambling! Happy gaming . . .

[Trachmir]

Then perhaps it would be better to have "roads" and "highways", one to interconect your city (that would appear as a fine network of roads), and the other to connect cities (which would be much more noticable, like roads in civ2). I'll settle for that compromise...

...but with out PW, my enthusiasm for the game has taken a sharp decline!

[Imran Siddiqui]

Why? Did you like SMAC? That didn't have PW.

I'd rather not have PW, and with this new update, my interest has gone up (I didn't think it could either ).

[Zanzin]

But the micromangament!!! Think of the micromanagement!!!!!

[connorkimbro]

I hope my comments about queueing orders to the worker units didn't go unnoticed. That was a good idea. . .

[ChrisShaffer]

quote: But the micromangament!!! Think of the micromanagement!!!!!

Yup. Thinking of it. Looking forward to it. Drooling over it. Bring it on. You can keep your CTP public works. I'm perfectly happy to build my empire with my own workers.

[Trachmir]

Yeah, but terraformers didn't cost one population!

Besides, SMAC was about taming (or being tamed) by an alien planet... terraformers fit, but why must we have an actual unit to represent workers! The thought of moving dozens upon dozens of workers every turn does NOT make me happy.