This is great news for 1.18f!!

[Dida]

This is good additon to the game.
However, it will surely unbalance the game if some ships are not given the ability to shoot down air plane.
Another badly needed improvement is, when bombing cities, bombers should hit units most of the time, and only accidentally kills citizens and buildings.

[godinex]

And the cruiser missiles?

And what will happen with the cruiser missiles?

[Gramphos]

Originally posted by Dida
Another badly needed improvement is, when bombing cities, bombers should hit units most of the time, and only accidentally kills citizens and buildings.

I think it should depend on the government of the bombarder. If a low level government it should be more destructive, on other then military units and buildings, but the more humane the government is the more focus on military units and improvements should the bombard have.

[laurentius]

Does the f in 1.18f stand for finnish?

[Gramphos]

Originally posted by laurentius
Does the f in 1.18f stand for finnish?

f in all the versions stands for finalized, and b for beta.

[ACooper]

Sure it's not for "f"ed up?


Sorry, couldn't help it.

[Dida]

Originally posted by Gramphos

I think it should depend on the government of the bombarder. If a low level government it should be more destructive, on other then military units and buildings, but the more humane the government is the more focus on military units and improvements should the bombard have.

I disagree.
We are talking about combat here. And how combat is carried out does not depend on the humanity of the invader.
No Nazi or Japanese will knowingly waste their bombs on citizens and buildings, if there are more important things(military units) to bomb.
Carpet bombing, or bombings that are aimed to kill civilians are of different matter.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Dida
I disagree.
We are talking about combat here. And how combat is carried out does not depend on the humanity of the invader.
No Nazi or Japanese will knowingly waste their bombs on citizens and buildings, if there are more important things(military units) to bomb.
Carpet bombing, or bombings that are aimed to kill civilians are of different matter.

Well, hmmm. You mean like when the Luftwaffe switched to bombing civilian targets in 1940 during the BofB? Or what they did to Warsaw in 1939? And Rotterdam in 1940? How about the Japanese bombing of (d*mn, can't remember the name of that city in China) in 1937(?)? How about the bombardment of Bilboa during the Spanish civil war (by the Facists)?

And like how RAF bombing of Germany was almost exclusively at night, and aimed at transportation/industrial areas and the people who worked around them? How about the fire storms? Weren't they intentionally set to destroy entire cities and as many people in them as possible?

I do agree with you to a point though. It would be better if bombers could be given priorities that would effect the odds of hitting target types. Not precision, just guided. But I don't see it as too likely. Does the game really need it? Simplicity seems to be the watch word of the designers.

Salve

[player1]

Just one observation:

When Allies bombarded Belgrade in 1944 there was more civilian casualties then when Nazi bombarded Belgrade in 1941.
(they were huge in both cases)


Bombs don't know ideology.

There is only decicion: bomb or not to bomb.

[Goatguy]

HeyHey

Wow...this is hot topic...i guess its just a thing that everybudy wants...its great that fixaris staff is watching forums and making changes based on the masses

I agree with Sinapus..ships need to have a defence against planes. But in real life today, a plane usually never sees a ship that it attacks. Its the missle that dose the mission. Dog fights will never happen again, becuase missles make it "easy" .

But what is the most powerful unit in modern warfare? Aircraft Carriers are only part of the answer. Its PLANES that could wipe out hoards or ships, returning unscathed (sorry dac ). The united states could wipe out every navy in the world with carrier battle groups, and most of its planes would come out unscathed! Today in the news, you hear reports of 1 or 2 men dieing. When you think of the many people involved, that is very few people. Just compare it to trench warfare.

And Gramphos, making bombardment a government thing would be kinda krazy I mean, say your a monarchy...you could only bombard military units?? Or democracy could only bombard improvments?? That just simply wouldnt work. It needs to rely on chance, and i dont think there is any signifigant pattern in figuring out whats destroyed..except maybe units be4 improvments

But back to ship defense. A carrier full of planes is a real world defense to ANYTHING!! So do it in civ....loada carrier full of fighters and keep other ships close...all i can say on that topic

And toasty... when it said "leathal bombing", it meant that that unit COULD obliterate a unit. not that that unit could be obliterated itself. Battleships and artillery would now have the chance to kill a unit when bombarding. Infantry arnt bombard units, so they could now kill a unit by bombarding. But like any unit, it could be killed by bombardment by other units

Hope that helps...see u around in the forums

[OneFootInTheGrave]

YES YES WOHOOOO



LOVLEY IMPROVEMENT

[Grumbold]

Re: HeyHey

Originally posted by Goatguy
I agree with Sinapus..ships need to have a defence against planes. But in real life today, a plane usually never sees a ship that it attacks. Its the missle that dose the mission. Dog fights will never happen again, becuase missles make it "easy" .

Missiles shoot planes down easy too, and ships carry LOTS of missiles. Even infantry carry missiles. Ships are bigger targets but they also carry shiploads of anti-missile defences and electronic countermeasures to offset that a bit. In reality its all about detection. Whoever identifies a target and fires first has a high probability of winning. If you want to play with missiles its probably best to stick with the cruise missile being lethal to everything and let it represent any modern missile fired from any platform with a warhead appropriate to the intended target.

[whosurdaddy]

Originally posted by notyoueither


Well, hmmm. You mean like when the Luftwaffe switched to bombing civilian targets in 1940 during the BofB? Or what they did to Warsaw in 1939? And Rotterdam in 1940? How about the Japanese bombing of (d*mn, can't remember the name of that city in China) in 1937(?)? How about the bombardment of Bilboa during the Spanish civil war (by the Facists)?

And like how RAF bombing of Germany was almost exclusively at night, and aimed at transportation/industrial areas and the people who worked around them? How about the fire storms? Weren't they intentionally set to destroy entire cities and as many people in them as possible?

I do agree with you to a point though. It would be better if bombers could be given priorities that would effect the odds of hitting target types. Not precision, just guided. But I don't see it as too likely. Does the game really need it? Simplicity seems to be the watch word of the designers.

Salve

Do the Firebombings of Dresden, Tokyo, Berlin, etc. by the Allies ring a bell???
How bout Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

The fact is that both sides participated in these attrocities during WW2, because it was considered an acceptable tactic (known as targeting the "morale" of the enemy people).

[Coracle]

Originally posted by Dom Pedro II
Right now, I'd be more happy with having the option of making Artillery units Offensive units so the AI might actually be smart enough to use it in massed invasions... they NEVER use artillery in effective ways. They might actually stand a chance in the early early industrial period if they could bring down a city's defenses with artillery first and THEN chuck their cavalry at them...

You're right!

I once went into the Editor and told the French civ to build more artillery.

During a game I used the "multi.sav" cheat option to see what was going on, and despite the fact that my French allies were at war with my enemy, England, and the French were invading, EVERY ARTILLERY UNIT was left in the French cities! Some cities had six artillery units sitting there.

That stupid, stupid AI.

Patch 1.18?? As we continue to playtest Civ III, doing Firaxis' work for them at a cost of $45 each, I wonder what patch will finally get it right. Maybe 1.99?

[D.K]

well, i was going to mention the worst bombings in human history were by the americans ON the japanese, and yet the japanese were mentioned as though THEY were in some way inhuman.

but whosurdaddy got there first